P-51 Mustang family aside, any other good implementations of ventral Meredith radiators, or good ways to do it?

[BarnOwlLover]

As far as location, the mounting for the Mustang's radiator, it probably just made the most sense for it to be there. I was even thinking about that for the Spitfire. The late decision (from what I read) to abandon evaporative cooling for the Merlin on the Spitfire to conventional water/glycol/water-glycol blend governed the underwing radiators, as well as the mod having to be a bit of a "rush job".

You do also have to remember that the Supermarine 305 turret fighter had a chin radiator, and the 312 cannon fighter was envisioned to use a ventral radiator.

 

[Admiral Beez]

You could have a Mustang style radiator under each nacelle. But then you have to figure out where to put the main landing gear.

Good points. I now think chin radiators like on the FW-187 would be the best option for the Whirlwind.

Two engines one rad are out, but the Spitfire’s two rads one engine is in.

 

[spicmart]

You could have a Mustang style radiator under each nacelle. But then you have to figure out where to put the main landing gear.

It might be possible to retract the landing gear not by retracting it backwards but perpendicular to the engine line with.
If you install such a radiator and its air intake on the side of the nacelle you need not to build it as long as it would be the case when mounting it ventrally.
But you would have to have exhaust stacks which lead away the exhausts from the radiator air intake.
Lke on the Me 110.
In both cases the rear of the nacelles would be quite long.
Maybe even combine the radiator exhaust with turbocharger exhaust if there is one..

 

[BarnOwlLover]

In any case, single or twin engine, you'll need a fair amount of space for a good Meredith radiator. Here's a couple of cutaways of a XP-51G and P-51H (both used a refined version of the P-51B/C/D/K radiator system).

And a couple P-51D for reference.

 

[BarnOwlLover]

Also, the P-51H (and the XP-51F/G) have a longer fuselage than the earlier models. Could that help with refining the radiator shrouding, as well as the F-82?

 

[BarnOwlLover]

Also, I'd like to submit this drawing. Is the radiator installation (this being a 1940 concept illustration) decent, good, or crap?

 

[pbehn]

Also, I'd like to submit this drawing. Is the radiator installation (this being a 1940 concept illustration) decent, good, or crap?

View attachment 697453

Some things are obvious and others arent. There were numerous changes to the Mustang and P-51 radiator system. They all look similar, only their place in the evolution of the plane gives away whether they were improvements or not to anyone who isnt an expert in either aerodynamics or the history of the plane. To me that needs the scoop moving back and the "splitter" increasing in size.

 

[GrauGeist]

It appears to me that the small scoop foreward of the main intake would disrupt the airflow enough that the boundary layer separation would not be the same as the P-51's.

 

[Shortround6]

It is a sketch so we can cut it a bit of slack.
However it does show one of the problems. If you use a short inlet before the air hits the radiator the air going to the top of radiator has to travel considerably further hit the radiator compared to the air hitting the bottom of the radiator and travel considerably further to reach the outlet using a short outlet.
The problem isn't necessarily the distance but the difference in distance which may be sorted out in detail design vs concept sketch.
The greater the difference in the direction the flow takes and the greater the difference in speeds of the airflow in the duct the greater the chances of turbulence in the airflow no matter what was done with boundary layer separation.

Leaving the intake where it is, move the actual radiator back several feet to reduce the angles in the airflow, then add not only the existing outlet but extend it also an additional several feet (you are now just short of the tail wheel) to help straighten out the exit airflow.
Now is that "different" from the sketch or just detail/development?

 

[BarnOwlLover]

I'm guessing it wouldn't be wise to fare the radiator exit into the fuselage (keeping the fuselage taper near constant without the raised area leading from the exit to the tail)?

 

[tomo pauk]

I'm guessing it wouldn't be wise to fare the radiator exit into the fuselage (keeping the fuselage taper near constant without the raised area leading from the exit to the tail)?

Looking much like the rear end of the CASA C-101 or the Pampa?

 

[BarnOwlLover]

What I mean is how much the radiator housing sticks out compared to the rear of the fuselage. I know that was a feature of even the Allison powered versions. But it is necessary to have the tail/rear of the fuselage raised so much in contour compared to the front fuselage's underside?

 

[GrauGeist]

What I mean is how much the radiator housing sticks out compared to the rear of the fuselage. I know that was a feature of even the Allison powered versions. But it is necessary to have the tail/rear of the fuselage raised so much in contour compared to the front fuselage's underside?

A great deal of early aircraft design was really hit or miss.

By the 1930's, aircraft design theory was still an unexplored territory, as powered flight itself was entering it's third decade.

 

[BarnOwlLover]

Though it was never actually built or flown, and I don't believe that any detail design docs exist for it, but what about the Hawker P.1027 project for a Rolls-Royce Eagle powered Tempest that did use a ventral radiator similar to the XP-51F/G and the P-51H and F-82?

Hawker P.1027 and P.1030

In 1943, anticipating the availability of the 3,500-4,020 hp Rolls-Royce Eagle 22 engine, Hawker proposed two new versions of the Tempest with greater cooling capability, the P.1027 with Mustang-like ventral radiator and the P.1030 with leading edge radiators, but no prototypes were ordered...

www.secretprojects.co.uk

Hawker P 1030

Hello Any one can help me please. I'm looking for more precise 3-view drawings and fuselage sections (if it's possible) of the Hawker P 1030 because I want make a radio controled aircraft of this plane. Many thanks

www.secretprojects.co.uk

 

[spicmart]

A Spitfire with full Meredith-effect capability would have been the ultimate fighter of WW2. It was already the supreme dogfighter. Coupled with a speed increase of 40 or 50 km/h it would habe been superior to all other super-props with maybe the exception of the P-51H. Your opinions?