RAF to Obtain F-35A Airframes

[buffnut453]

The BBC is reporting that the RAF is to acquire 12 F-35As as a stepping-stone towards recreating an airborne nuclear weapon delivery capability:

UK to purchase nuclear-carrying F-35A fighter jets

Downing Street says the move is "the biggest strengthening of the UK's nuclear posture in a generation".

www.bbc.com

It will certainly take some time to bring back air-delivered nukes into the inventory and train air and ground crews in their handling, carriage and delivery. I'm also concerned that 12 airframes isn't sufficient to equip a squadron. Hopefully, the UK will spring for a number of additional A-variant airframes.

It always bugged me that the UK went whole-hog on the F-35B given its relatively poor performance compared to the A- and C- variants. This latest news is most welcome but I'd really like to see a sustainable fleet of F-35As rather than a token gesture. Perhaps the UK will scale back their plans for F-35B purchases and replace them with F-35As. One can only hope!

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

The BBC is reporting that the RAF is to acquire 12 F-35As as a stepping-stone towards recreating an airborne nuclear weapon delivery capability:

UK to purchase nuclear-carrying F-35A fighter jets

Downing Street says the move is "the biggest strengthening of the UK's nuclear posture in a generation".

www.bbc.com

It will certainly take some time to bring back air-delivered nukes into the inventory and train air and ground crews in their handling, carriage and delivery. I'm also concerned that 12 airframes isn't sufficient to equip a squadron. Hopefully, the UK will spring for a number of additional A-variant airframes.

It always bugged me that the UK went whole-hog on the F-35B given its relatively poor performance compared to the A- and C- variants. This latest news is most welcome but I'd really like to see a sustainable fleet of F-35As rather than a token gesture. Perhaps the UK will scale back their plans for F-35B purchases and replace them with F-35As. One can only hope!

I agree that 12 simply isn't enough. Between refit, standby, and ops, maybe six available for the balloon?

 

[rochie]

Will we be able to air to air refuel them ?

Or will they be reliant on US tankers, but that may be a moot point as it looks like the US will retain control of any nuclear weapons they might carry !

 

[GTX]

I am kind of curious as to why you appear to think the F-35B has poor performance

 

[buffnut453]

I am kind of curious as to why you appear to think the F-35B has poor performance

I didn't say it had poor performance...I said it had poor performance relative to the A and C variants, which is absolutely correct. It has shorter range and can't carry as many weapons due to smaller weapons bays. It's also lugging round the lift engine which is extra (dead) weight that's not in the other 2 variants.

 

[buffnut453]

Will we be able to air to air refuel them ?

Or will they be reliant on US tankers, but that may be a moot point as it looks like the US will retain control of any nuclear weapons they might carry !

Good point. AFAIK, the UK isn't going down the boom route for AAR so, yes, there will be a dependence on USAF tankers.

 

[buffnut453]

I agree that 12 simply isn't enough. Between refit, standby, and ops, maybe six available for the balloon?

Actually, the A variant has the lowest number of maintenance hours per flight hour so they might be able to squeeze 8 serviceable from the 12 airframes.

It should also be noted that this is probably just an interim purchase. The UK has set a "headmark" (not sure what that means other than yet another BS term for goal or target) of 138 F-35 airframes. According to the RAF's own website, this isn't 12 additional airframe purchases - they've just changed the mix for the 27 purchases already planned to be 12 As and 15 Bs instead of all Bs:

As part of the second phase procurement plans of 27 aircraft, we will purchase a combination of twelve F-35A and fifteen F-35B variants, with options on further purchases examined in the Defence Investment Plan. The UK has a declared headmark of 138 aircraft through the life of the F-35 programme.

Day-to-day, the F-35As will be used in a training role on 207 Squadron, the Operational Conversion Unit (OCU). As the F-35A carries more fuel than the F-35B variant, it can stay airborne for longer, extending the available training time in each sortie for student pilots. As F-35As also require fewer maintenance hours, there will be increased aircraft availability on the OCU. These factors combined will improve pilot training and reduce the amount of time for pilots to reach the front-line squadrons.

The F-35A will complement the existing F-35B, offering a family of strike aircraft that significantly reduces life-cycle costs, meets operational requirements, and improves F-35 Force Generation for Carrier Strike operations.

Designed to operate from conventional runways, the F-35A offers increased range, increased payloads, and increased agility. The new fast jets will be based at RAF Marham and support the stand-up of a third front line F-35 Lightning Squadron.

The F-35A is the common variant in Europe making it a force multiplier for NATO. This will strengthen allied deterrence and interoperability, supporting the Alliance for the challenges of today and tomorrow.

Source: RAF F-35A marks a significant step in delivering a more lethal Integrated Force and joining NATO Nuclear Mission

 

[GTX]

I didn't say it had poor performance...I said it had poor performance relative to the A and C variants, which is absolutely correct. It has shorter range and can't carry as many weapons due to smaller weapons bays. It's also lugging round the lift engine which is extra (dead) weight that's not in the other 2 variants.

Ok my misread sorry

 

[GreenKnight121]

Perhaps the UK will scale back their plans for F-35B purchases and replace them with F-35As. One can only hope!

The F-35A is absolutely incapable of performing the primary mission of the F-35B - operating from the QE class aircraft carriers of the Royal Navy!

However, I agree that the RAF needs at least one additional squadron worth of F-35As - if not two. Then all of the F-35Bs could be turned over to the RN and the RAF would operate only the F-35As.


The reason the F-35As are needed is that they are equipped and cleared for deployment of the B61 nuclear bombs, while the F-35B & F-35C are not.

 

[buffnut453]

The F-35A is absolutely incapable of performing the primary mission of the F-35B - operating from the QE class aircraft carriers of the Royal Navy!

I never said the F-35A could operate from the QE carriers. My wider point is that the UK was solely focused on the F-35B, due in no small part to the prevalence of former Harrier jocks in senior positions within the RAF. My frustration is that the STOVL role is great in concept but hasn't actually been necessary in operational reality. Given the complexity of the F-35, what are the odds that we'd deploy it into the woods to operate from rural roads? I just don't see that happening.

The original specification for the QE carriers required the ability for the vessels to be converted, during refit, between ramp and cat-and-trap launch solutions. Since the cat-and-trap was deemed high risk and the option for converting between launch modes added greatly to the project cost, it was decided to focus solely on the ramp approach which forced the UK to go down the F-35B route (which was much approved by the Harrier mates).

I've said for decades that a better capability set for the UK would have been F-35Cs aboard cat-and-trap equipped QE carriers, with F-35As operating from land. The F-35B mafia wanted a single-type for the UK but events have proven that to be unworkable...but now the UK is tied to the least capable of all the F-35 variants for a large proportion of their overall purchase.

My hunch is that the UK will now purchase more F-35As and just operate enough Bs to enable the carriers to operate. It will be interesting to see if the Bs are all passed to the FAA or if the current Joint RN/RAF construct is maintained.