Surviving Bristol Phoenix

[brianwnz]

Does anyone in the UK (or anywhere else for that matter) know what happened to the original Bristol Phoenix engine? According to the records I have regarding it (AVIA 8/436), the "one and only prototype" was in a museum in 1938 - anyone know what museum? Has it survived today? If not, anyone know what happened/when?

While I'm at it, can anyone comment on whether the Phoenix I (non-supercharged) was converted to the Phoenix II.M (medium-supercharged)? As far as I can tell it was, assuming PH.12001 (both engines referred to by this reference) is a serial number - a plausible numbering system for the time as far as I can tell....

And I may as well also ask if anyone knows whether a II.S (full-supercharge) was ever built/converted, or was it a paper-design only?

I've been trying to make contact with Bristol Aerospace archives to arrange a visit in the future - anyone have a direct contact, as I get no response from website emails to the archive address. As I live in Australia, it's a long way to go just to find it's closed for the week.....

 

[ThomasP]

If you have not already run across it, there is a book - "Aircraft Diesels" by Paul H. Wilkinson, published in 1940 - that might have some of the info you are looking for.

Also, the San Diego Air and Space Museum may have something for you. I found this link to a box of papers in their archive:

"Hallett (George E.A.) Personal Papers"

Do a word search using "Phoenix" and it will show the appropriate relevant entry in the Box 1 inventory. Maybe get in touch with them?

Happy hunting

 

[Snautzer01]

Perhaps D Deleted member 68059 knows a way to contact them.

 

[Deleted member 68059]

Does anyone in the UK (or anywhere else for that matter) know what happened to the original Bristol Phoenix engine? According to the records I have regarding it (AVIA 8/436), the "one and only prototype" was in a museum in 1938 - anyone know what museum? Has it survived today? If not, anyone know what happened/when?

While I'm at it, can anyone comment on whether the Phoenix I (non-supercharged) was converted to the Phoenix II.M (medium-supercharged)? As far as I can tell it was, assuming PH.12001 (both engines referred to by this reference) is a serial number - a plausible numbering system for the time as far as I can tell....

And I may as well also ask if anyone knows whether a II.S (full-supercharge) was ever built/converted, or was it a paper-design only?

I've been trying to make contact with Bristol Aerospace archives to arrange a visit in the future - anyone have a direct contact, as I get no response from website emails to the archive address. As I live in Australia, it's a long way to go just to find it's closed for the week.....

The more workshy of the British industries seem to think Christmas means more or less refusing to do work in December then thinkimg its fine to close or pretend to be closed for at least the first two weeks of January.

 

[ThomasP]

I still think we need an emoji for both funny and informative.

 

[Deleted member 68059]

I still think we need an emoji for both funny and informative.

I pray you dont need to cottact Rolls-Royce Heritage Trust Bristol Branch.

They`ve been closed for years ever since RR joyously realised Covid meant they could shut down all their heritage archives, and then "re-organize" them, meaning they could then just "forget" to ever open them again. From the replies I get from RR, its debatable it will ever re-open. "Its a defence site" they said, no access.
(its was a defence site when it was OPEN too).

Their main Derby archives are shut too, I`ve been trying to get back in for... nearly 4 years. Every time I email them its due to reopen "in six months". Its like the bloody saussage cooking bit in the film SNATCH.

 

[ThomasP]

Just now, I tried selecting and removing the funny and the informative emoji alternatively every few seconds, but it is not very satisfying when I am the only one that can see it.

 

[SaparotRob]

I see lotsa' stuff others don't.

 

[brianwnz]

If you have not already run across it, there is a book - "Aircraft Diesels" by Paul H. Wilkinson, published in 1940 - that might have some of the info you are looking for.

Also, the San Diego Air and Space Museum may have something for you. I found this link to a box of papers in their archive:

"Hallett (George E.A.) Personal Papers"

Do a word search using "Phoenix" and it will show the appropriate relevant entry in the Box 1 inventory. Maybe get in touch with them?

Happy hunting

Thanks Thomas,
I have all three of Mr Wilkinson's books, sadly he doesn't mentioned what happened to the Phoenix - possibly too soon after events to know or think about what happened to the engine/s themselves.
I did stumble across the link to George Hallett's papers recently, and the staff at San Diego were great at getting back to me, and then scanning the 'Phoenix' material to me, although it was simply a fuel/weight/range/graph without much link to any specific diesel mentioned.
Appreciate your comments & thoughts though - I might just have to wait until I get to the UK and hope I can ask around over there - I would assume if it's anywhere it would be in the RRHT Bristol collection, or the London Science Museum, but it could also have been scrapped in the days when it was perhaps not considered that rare or special an item..... or possibly even destroyed in the factory bombing in WW2?

Thanks and regards,
Brian

 

[brianwnz]

I pray you dont need to cottact Rolls-Royce Heritage Trust Bristol Branch.

They`ve been closed for years ever since RR joyously realised Covid meant they could shut down all their heritage archives, and then "re-organize" them, meaning they could then just "forget" to ever open them again. From the replies I get from RR, its debatable it will ever re-open. "Its a defence site" they said, no access.
(its was a defence site when it was OPEN too).

Their main Derby archives are shut too, I`ve been trying to get back in for... nearly 4 years. Every time I email them its due to reopen "in six months". Its like the bloody saussage cooking bit in the film SNATCH.

Thanks Calum,

Aaaah, sadly that's exactly who I wanted to contact, as well as Aerospace Bristol...... It is a pity it isn't just handed over to National Archives; they at least seem to have a very good system of remote access - and I envy those of you in the UK who can turn up in person and peruse them; remote scanning get's pricey!

I hope at least you have better luck at Derby; thanks for your time in replying.

Thanks and regards,
Brian

 

[Deleted member 68059]

Thanks Calum,

Aaaah, sadly that's exactly who I wanted to contact, as well as Aerospace Bristol...... It is a pity it isn't just handed over to National Archives; they at least seem to have a very good system of remote access - and I envy those of you in the UK who can turn up in person and peruse them; remote scanning get's pricey!

I hope at least you have better luck at Derby; thanks for your time in replying.

Thanks and regards,
Brian

I would suggest that you email Rolls Royce Heritage Trust and pester them about the Bristol group archive and ask WHY it is closed and WHEN it will be open.

Unless they get peppered with complaints, nothing will happen >

[email protected]

I was told a few months ago that there was no access "because it was a defence site" - this is nonsense because it was a defence site when I visited them
too, you had to sign in at the gate and be met by a RRHT staff member on site. That was no issue then, its simply an excuse.

 

[brianwnz]

I would suggest that you email Rolls Royce Heritage Trust and pester them about the Bristol group archive and ask WHY it is closed and WHEN it will be open.

Unless they get peppered with complaints, nothing will happen >

[email protected]

I was told a few months ago that there was no access "because it was a defence site" - this is nonsense because it was a defence site when I visited them
too, you had to sign in at the gate and be met by a RRHT staff member on site. That was no issue then, its simply an excuse.

Thanks Calum,

Appreciate the advice, that is exactly what I'm going to do

Regards,

Brian