The OA-1K Skyraider II

[Sabrejet]

And AJI/Aeronca Super Pinto?

 

[nuuumannn]

A great idea, the USAF and Army has never had a shortage of COIN airframes offered to them. Here's one I spotted at the Paris Airshow a few years back.

AT-6

 

[Big Jake]

A great idea, the USAF and Army has never had a shortage of COIN airframes offered to them. Here's one I spotted at the Paris Airshow a few years back.

View attachment 820478AT-6

This is again - a trainer modified to COIN.

 

[GrauGeist]

This is again - a trainer modified to COIN.

Quite a few trainers were modified to Attack/COIN capable platforms.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

I question the wisdom, so to speak, of the USAF investing in COIN aircraft when those wars are actually over. It smacks of generals refighting the last war rather than planning for the next. This is money that could probably be better used elsewhere -- admittedly not much money -- but these are planes that will be very vulnerable to MANPADS and perhaps even drones in the near future.

 

[SaparotRob]

You never know if or when the groundhogs will revolt. It's best to be prepared. Mutant corn, beware!

 

[MIflyer]

OV-10's were transferred to the Dept of State Air Wing where they were modified for drug interdiction missions. They did the mods at Patrick AFB. After 9/11/01 some OV-10's were used for security patrol of Cape Canaveral and KSC.

But the OV-10 had a lot less weapons capability than the new A-1K. On the other hand it was two seat and had the capability of carrying cargo or people behind the cockpit. They used OV-10 to parachute teams of observers into Cambodia, since they were a lot less obvious than landing UH-1's.

 

[Sabrejet]

OV-10's were transferred to the Dept of State Air Wing where they were modified for drug interdiction missions. They did the mods at Patrick AFB.

Similar situation with the Ayres S2Ts I assume?

 

[GrauGeist]

OV-10's were transferred to the Dept of State Air Wing where they were modified for drug interdiction missions. They did the mods at Patrick AFB. After 9/11/01 some OV-10's were used for security patrol of Cape Canaveral and KSC.

But the OV-10 had a lot less weapons capability than the new A-1K. On the other hand it was two seat and had the capability of carrying cargo or people behind the cockpit. They used OV-10 to parachute teams of observers into Cambodia, since they were a lot less obvious than landing UH-1's.

The OV-10 is also used by several fire agencies, like CalFire and USFS and I believe NASA aquired several.

 

[BobB]

It is amazing that throughout history, COIN missions were assigned to aircraft modified to the mission: T-6, then T-28, then A-26, then A-1, even a Piper developed version of the P-51, modified T-37 and even Cessna Skymaster. And now the 802 AirTractor.

Only one aircraft was designed from the start as a dedicated COIN aircraft - the OV-10. It was a great success but interest in COIN went away with the end of the Vietnam war and so the use of the type by the US. It continued to be used very successfully by other countries, though. The OV-10, with modernized engines and systems, could be a much more potent and better solution to the COIN issue than the 802.

(Deviating from the subject matter - the A-10s should have been transferred to the Army!).

The Grumman OV-1 could have been a great COIN aircraft but the AF didn't want the Army to have fixed wing combat capability and didn't really want to operate COIN aircraft itself.

 

[Sabrejet]

So no-one's answered about the Ayres S2Ts: were they too secret to talk about?

 

[cvairwerks]

They only built 9 of the NEDS and only 24 of the S2R-660's, so not a big total production. The last of the -660's was delivered in 2016. The -660's also have an extremely reduced commonality with the S2R-T, it's essentially a custom aircraft, where as the Air Tractor has a very high commonality with the Fire Boss version.

 

[MIflyer]

the AF didn't want the Army to have fixed wing combat capability

And the Army did not want the USAF to have armed helicopters, either, exceptions being the Jolly Greens, to a limited extent.

 

[Sabrejet]

They only built 9 of the NEDS and only 24 of the S2R-660's, so not a big total production. The last of the -660's was delivered in 2016. The -660's also have an extremely reduced commonality with the S2R-T, it's essentially a custom aircraft, where as the Air Tractor has a very high commonality with the Fire Boss version.

Are any of these still in service?

Incidentally, those numbers seem a bit 'off'; I think that there were at least three S2Ts of various types used as NEDS aircraft prior to the 'nine'. The reason I ask is that I recall the Vigilante was proposed at one point in a COIN-type role and I wondered if any were ever configured from the various drug sprayers.

 

[cvairwerks]

Are any of these still in service?

Incidentally, those numbers seem a bit 'off'; I think that there were at least three S2Ts of various types used as NEDS aircraft prior to the 'nine'. The reason I ask is that I recall the Vigilante was proposed at one point in a COIN-type role and I wondered if any were ever configured from the various drug sprayers.

From the sources I could find, only 9 aircraft were built to the NED configuration and were ever delivered to the State Department.There was at least one prototype that was not delivered. As to the Vigilante, it appears that only a prototype was built, and it was to be based on the NEDS bird without the spray gear. The Thrush birds that were developed into the Archangel configuration and delivered to the UAE, their status is unknown, as part of them were sent to Jordan a while after the UAE got them. Based on how things operate over there, I suspect that none of them are airworthy anymore, in either county.

 

[Barrett]

Seeing some email among purists who object to gluing another company's name on a Brand X airframe, as per MCDONNELL DOUGLAS' "Avenger II A-12 fifthgenerationstealthbomberjet. That was a colossal frabup, as some CCs will recall. I think litigation took 22-23 years before McBoeing had to refund some of the advance. "Here there be lawyers."

 

[MIflyer]

Did Douglas sue Cessna over the name "Skyhawk"?

Back when, there was a push to get the F-16 named "Hawk." It certainly tended to duplicate the Curtiss Hawk experience in terms of worldwide sales.

 

[GrauGeist]

Several U.S. aircraft of different manufacturers shared the same name, like the Republic P-43 Lancer - Rockwell B-1 Lancer.