The truth is stranger than fiction: WW2 facts that you would call BS if seen on a movie...

[SaparotRob]

Any evidence of this anywhere?

 

[Admiral Beez]

Grant, you forgot the airship that attacked a submarine...

And the submarines that were to attack airships. https://hmse22.wixsite.com/memorial/hms-e22

 

[fastmongrel]

How about the bomber that bombed itself. A Blackburn Skua dropped 2 Anti Submarine bombs on a U Boat at too low an altitude and at too shallow an angle, The bombs richocheted off the sea exploded under the aircraft which then crashed into the sea, luckily the dazed and surprised crew survived and were rescued by the rather puzzled U Boat crew.

 

[SaparotRob]

That must have been embarrassing.

 

[The Basket]

That must have been embarrassing.

Flying the Skua?

 

[The Basket]

Pretty much anything the Swordfish did.

Except the Channel Dash. That was par for the course.

 

[swampyankee]

Utter nonsense, if "The Bengal famine" did anything it hastened the formation of Bangladesh as a separate nation to India, all discussion of "The Bengal famine" ignores the fact that the Japanese were just a few miles away, that India had the food and Churchill was in England. Many regions of India didn't and don't like each other as we can see today, but you can find some activist who will prove Churchill was responsible for that too.

To be pedantic, Bangladesh didn't become a separate country until it separated from Pakistan after the Bangladesh Liberation War, which ended in 1971. I believe the proximal cause of the Liberation War was the actions of the military junta which had taken over the government of Pakistan and started a mass murder of Bangladesh's independence advocates and massacres such as those at the Dhaka University and with Operation Searchlight. When India gained its independence and Pakistan was separated from the British administrative region called "India," it was divided into West Pakistan, which is now the country of Pakistan, and East Pakistan, which became Bangladesh in 1971.

 

[pbehn]

To be pedantic, Bangladesh didn't become a separate country until it separated from Pakistan after the Bangladesh Liberation War, which ended in 1971. I believe the proximal cause of the Liberation War was the actions of the military junta which had taken over the government of Pakistan and started a mass murder of Bangladesh's independence advocates and massacres such as those at the Dhaka University and with Operation Searchlight. When India gained its independence and Pakistan was separated from the British administrative region called "India," it was divided into West Pakistan, which is now the country of Pakistan, and East Pakistan, which became Bangladesh in 1971.

I know, and the partition cost up to 2 million lives in "peacetime" with approximately 12 million displaced. I don't know whether Churchill was to blame for that or if they managed to pin some of it on Thatcher.

 

[swampyankee]

Churchill was a known and vocal, even rabid, opponent of Indian independence. On the other hand, I don't think he held particular responsibility for the 1943 famine in India, and he directed some active efforts at famine relief take place.

I think anyone who has read anything about the partition of India would agree that it ended up being a horror show. What I find interesting is that the country that seemed (from this far distant perspective) that Pakistan, which has had a very troubled relationship with democracy, seems to be the more favored by the West.

 

[Admiral Beez]

I think anyone who has read anything about the partition of India would agree that it ended up being a horror show.

It was poorly done for certain, starting with the guy given the responsibility for drawing the new lines having just arrived, with little knowledge or interest in the welfare or interests of the inhabitants. Cyril Radcliffe, 1st Viscount Radcliffe - Wikipedia

 

[MIflyer]

The uncle of a friend of mine was with a US Army unit that paused on its way across France after the Normandy Invasion. They helped a French lady whose barn had been knocked down and he struck up a friendship with the lady's daughter. The unit moved on and that night he dearly wanted to go visit the daughter. So he swiped a motorcycle, rode back to the farm and spent the night there, intending to get up before dawn and ride back to his unit before anyone realized that he and the motorcycle were missing.

When he awoke he was shocked to see it was already light out and, it had snowed. He headed back to his unit, getting confused because the route looked so different due to the snow. And he suddenly realized he had ridden into a group of German soldiers, who were shaving and eating breakfast. He immediately told them he needed to talk to their commander.

He had noted during the ride in daylight that the motorcycle had captain's bars painted on it. He introduced himself as Capt Berry and explained that his colonel had directed him to go ask for the German's surrender and that the Americans had them surrounded and their situation was hopeless. The German commander agreed but told him he expected Berry to bring his colonel to accept the surrender. Berry left and found his way back to his unit, where a grim faced group awaited him. They were going to take him into custody but he explained he had accepted the surrender of about 100 Germans and needed to go back there with the colonel tro seal the deal, which they did. When the story hit the Stars and Stripes newspaper his superiors decided it would be too hard to explain why they sent the "hero" to jail and let his unauthorized leave and motorcycle theft slide.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Churchill was a known and vocal, even rabid, opponent of Indian independence.

Opponent yes, but Churchill had no plan or interest in persuading India to stay within the Empire. Sending India's men to die in ill-conceived deployment to Malaya (is this India's ANZ Gallipoli debacle?) doesn't help.

 

[pbehn]

India would have been independent sooner if not for the war, asking the British to rule on the borders between the future states was a nonsense, like asking the Romans to decide on the Scottish border the day before they left.

 

[yulzari]

Good luck getting the 'Indian' and 'Pakistani' partied to agree on a frontier. But we stray from aviation.

 

[yosimitesam]

That horse transport still played a large part in most armies until mid-late war years.

The large number of rounds fired without hitting the target, even the 88 anti-tank gun during its best times with Afrika Korp was ~ 7% hit rate.

Yes, normal dispersion at maxium range. ATG's usually opened fire at the longest range they could penetrate, which was probably 1500-2000yds (meters) for a gun with the power of the 88. Barrel wear, tiny differences in powder charge volumes, variations in the machining of the shells (no two anything made by man are exactly alike, if you look close enough) were all part of the normal dispersion of all artillery weapons. Since range was the most critical (and most difficult to determine), the higher the MV of the ATG the better, i.e. the "range bracket" for a hit was greater. We could also add that visual bombing by the Americans using the Norden bombsight still resulted in an average of only 32% landing with 1000 feet of the aiming point. This dispersion was due to higher altitudes amplifying any normal angular error plus variable (unpredicable) winds from 25,000-ft down to the ground along with visibility problems.

 

[yosimitesam]

Mr. Spielberg & Mr. Hanks - please make a series about Duško Popov (too bad he was not seen as interesting person in ex-Yu and on, here). He is almost unknown today.
Also - the US and German soldiers, together with French high-ups, defending the Castle Itter.

I read (somewhere) that Popov was the "model" for Ian Fleming's "James Bond" character. He was certainly an interesting character worthy of a Hollywood movie. I read the book he wrote and his report of meeting J. Edgar Hoover of the FBI is both hilarious and frightening.

 

[yosimitesam]

Oh yeah - and aircraft carriers made of sawdust and ice.

Or Lord Mountbatten almost killing US Adm King when the bullet he fired at the pykrete block richochets and clips the cuff of King's pants!

 

[swampyankee]

A lot of people seem to disbelieve actual facts of WW2, such as, say, the Holocaust, even when confronted by actual physical evidence.

An event that movies can barely exaggerate is the Norwegian Resistance's destruction of the heavy water plant at Telemark.

 

[Dinger]

How about the bomber that bombed itself. A Blackburn Skua dropped 2 Anti Submarine bombs on a U Boat at too low an altitude and at too shallow an angle, The bombs richocheted off the sea exploded under the aircraft which then crashed into the sea, luckily the dazed and surprised crew survived and were rescued by the rather puzzled U Boat crew.

Not one Skua but two - and nearly a third... But, as ever, its a complicated story - and if they had succeeded in sinking the sub it would have meant the Allies would not have got the German navy enigma codes at a critical phase of the war... Full story here...

The Sinking of the Fanad Head in WW2

 

[herman1rg]

A lot of people seem to disbelieve actual facts of WW2, such as, say, the Holocaust, even when confronted by actual physical evidence..

Flat earthers................................... (off topic I know)