Two FAA Squadrons, Vought Chesapeakes ordered to Singapore, Aug 1941

[Admiral Beez]

Per Fleet Air Arm.net in July 1941, FAA 811 Squadron received fourteen Vought Chesapeake dive bombers, out of a total fifty ex-French aircraft delivered to the British between June and Aug 1941. These were modified by the British with the addition of four forward firing .303 guns. I'm going to assume that sufficient aircraft have been delivered to equip two front line squadrons (rather than just 811 squadron) plus spares by July 1941, both of which are ordered to RNAS Sembawang. Ex-Skua, DB-experienced aircrew are assigned to lead the two squadrons.

Early August 1941 thirty-six Chesapeakes, wings folded and partially dismantled are loaded onto transports bound for Singapore, along with their aircrew and mechanics. Spares, drop tanks and compatible bombs are also provided. The two squadrons arrive in mid-Sept and after four weeks assembling and preparing their aircraft the two squadrons are deemed operational by mid-October. What should we do with these aircraft?

Interestingly, any that survive the coming fall of Singapore have the max 2,130 nmi ferry range (with drop tanks) to fly direct to Darwin, allowing them to fight on at Coral Sea. Though more likely any fleeing aircraft would go to HMS Indomitable when she's nearby in late January delivering Hurricanes (though that might be an admission of defeat) or to Burma.

As an aside, some Chesapeake history Chesapeake AL941 on Arran.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Just to clarify, I'm not suggesting two dozen or so Chesapeake dive-bombers will have any real impact on the battle for Malaya or Singapore. It's more the potential story I'm curious about, like the hopelessly obsolete Vilderbeests operating first from Singapore, then Java, unsuccessfully attacking a IJN cruiser and claiming eight transport ships sunk in later ops in the DEI before finally flying for Burma, albeit unsuccessfully. That last sortie is too bad it failed, as it would have made for an interesting arrival in Burma - imagine the state of those two final aircraft.

 

[buffnut453]

They'd essentially replace the 6 Wirraways of W Flt that were used for "dive bombing" and other ground attack missions. Having 2 squadrons of Chesapeakes, while hardly a superlative operational type, wouldn't be much worse, performance-wise, compared to the Wirraways...and at least they were purpose-built dive-bombers rather than the ad hoc lash-up that the Wirraways provided.

Not sure if many have seen the "soup plate siren" attached to at least one of the Wirraway airframes:

The above image came from a wartime Japanese aviation magazine. Basically, it's a standard air raid siren with fins attached so it would spin in the airstream. One of my sadly-missed friends was Wg Cdr Donald Pearson who conducted a test flight of this airframe. He was the second to fly, and he asked if the prior test had included a spin. He was answered in the affirmative so he duly tried to spin the beast...and found he couldn't get out of it. He tried everything in the book, ultimately "pudding basining" the stick and, somehow, the aircraft went into a normal dive from which he recovered. Needless to say, he tore a strip off the MU staff who'd told him it could be spun.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Not sure if many have seen the "soup plate siren" attached to at least one of the Wirraway airframes... The above image came from a wartime Japanese aviation magazine. Basically, it's a standard air raid siren with fins attached so it would spin in the airstream.

Very cool. Were they trying to emulate the Stuka's siren and its terrorizing of the men below?

 

[buffnut453]

Very cool. Were they trying to emulate the Stuka's siren and its terrorizing of the men below?

Yep. A very similar installation was installed on a 13 Sqn Blenheim that was flown during the Dieppe landings in 1942. This image shows the siren under the nose of the aircraft:

 

[Admiral Beez]

Were sirens a common thing on naval dive bombers like the SB2U? I'd think that the defenders wouldn't hear the siren over their own barrage of AA. Perhaps they'd add sirens if the Singapore-based Chesapeakes are intended for inland ops against the IJA in addition to maritime strike.

 

[buffnut453]

Were sirens a common thing on naval dive bombers like the SB2U? I'd think that the defenders wouldn't hear the siren over their own barrage of AA. Perhaps they'd add sirens if the Singapore-based Chesapeakes are intended for inland ops against the IJA in addition to maritime strike.

I'm unaware of sirens on any dive bombers except the Stuka.

 

[Admiral Beez]

What are the chances of the FAA pilots landing onto HMS Indomitable when she's off Sumatra in Jan 1942? I do not believe they'd have any experience landing this aircraft onto a carrier.

It's an admission of defeat I suppose, but those aircraft could prove useful when Indomitable is operating at Ceylon in March.

 

[nuuumannn]

Not sure if many have seen the "soup plate siren" attached to at least one of the Wirraway airframes:

There's something very odd about what's been done to this aircraft. There is a second opening aft of the cockpit that extends as far aft as the hori-stab leading edge. What's going on there? The rear fuse was a metal framework with nothing but control cables in it and covered over in fabric, so what is the hoop structure in the fuselage aft of where the rear canopy closes onto?

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

Were sirens a common thing on naval dive bombers like the SB2U? I'd think that the defenders wouldn't hear the siren over their own barrage of AA. Perhaps they'd add sirens if the Singapore-based Chesapeakes are intended for inland ops against the IJA in addition to maritime strike.

They would so long as the volume from the siren was okay. It's the same reason you can hear a guitar solo over the bass even though high-pitched notes push much less air than low notes: the frequencies are discrete enough that they don't "fight traffic", and instead each note or notes sits in its own frequency range without washing out other, separate freqs.

Plus, because high-freqs die out more rapidly than low freqs, they won't be heard on high approach, but by the time the bomber is diving overhead, the low-freq rumble (usually not right on top of the target anyway) is probably traveling longer through obstacles and is attenuated by them, while the screech is coming from straight above with no acoustic impediment. And while the guns are punctuated, the diving screech is continual for the time the plane is in its dive.

I don't know of any naval dive-bombers which used them, probably because the fear-effect is largely lost on men in the ship working in a sheltered and noisy environment.

 

[nuuumannn]

I don't know of any naval dive-bombers which used them, probably because the fear-effect is largely lost on men in the ship working in a sheltered and noisy environment.

Yeah, well, the Britis didn't fit a siren to the Blackburn Skuas because when the Germans saw them diving at them, they tended to run away in horror, suffering convulsions at how ugly they were...

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

Yeah, well, the Britis didn't fit a siren to the Blackburn Skuas because when the Germans saw them diving at them, they tended to run away in horror, suffering convulsions at how ugly they were...

"Achtung, it's a Rubik's Cube carrying a bomb!"

 

[Admiral Beez]

Yeah, well, the Britis didn't fit a siren to the Blackburn Skuas because when the Germans saw them diving at them, they tended to run away in horror, suffering convulsions at how ugly they were...

The Skua is arguably more attractive than the Stuka. But there aren't many dive bombers that weren't ugly. The Dauntless and Yokosuka D4Y Suisei are two of the better looking. Actually the Vindicator isn't bad.

 

[nuuumannn]

The Dauntless and Yokosuka D4Y Suisei

This is true, the SBD looks like a T-6 someone has overstressed the wings of, with its excessive dihedral and the D4Y looks like a basking shark around the front, but well proportioned toward the rear.

Dunno if the Skua is better looking than the Stuka; apart from an exaggerated rudder the latter looks purposeful, but the Skua looks misshapen and awkward, with its rearward swept undercarriage, upturned wingtips, elongated nose and near vertical windscreen, and a tail that looks as if its set too far forward. It's a bit upsetting to the eye.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

Ugly can be beautiful at times ... ask any American infantryman of the last thirty years:

 

[nuuumannn]

Ugly can be beautiful at times ... ask anu American infantryman of the last thirty years:

It can; beauty is in the eye of the beholder as we know but like anything there are varying degrees of ugly and seeing a Skua do the same thing doesn't have quite the same impact...

 

[buffnut453]

It can; beauty is in the eye of the beholder as we know but like anything there are varying degrees of ugly and seeing a Skua do the same thing doesn't have quite the same impact...

You're saying mean things about the Skua. I'm not sure we can be friends any more.

 

[nuuumannn]

Anyway, getting back to the point of the thread. I dunno what, if anything the Chesapeake is going to do other than provide the British with yet more aeroplanes they will lose on Japan's successful campaign in the region, that is, if they are not destroyed on the ground in raids against the airfields in advance of the invasion. Nevertheless, more airframes probably couldn't do the Allies any harm, but it does depend entirely on how effectively they are used once they get there.

 

[nuuumannn]

You're saying mean things about the Skua. I'm not sure we can be friends any more.

You say that, Mark, then you post a picture demonstrating exactly my point... sheesh...

 

[buffnut453]

Anyway, getting back to the point of the thread. I dunno what, if anything the Chesapeake is going to do other than provide the British with yet more aeroplanes they will lose on Japan's successful campaign in the region, that is, if they are not destroyed on the ground in raids against the airfields in advance of the invasion. Nevertheless, more airframes probably couldn't do the Allies any harm, but it does depend entirely on how effectively they are used once they get there.

I'd like to see them operate in conjunction with the Vildebeest torpedo attacks against maritime targets. As was proven at Midway, defending fighters would struggle to defend against both types of attack. And dive bombers would have greater accuracy than even low-level bombing.