ARTESH
Chief Master Sergeant
Mine are Pagan Tomcat and Tangri Cobra (TOW).
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Mine are Pagan Tomcat and Tangri Cobra (TOW).I like the Atheist F-22 myself.
Refers to Israeli Defensive Forces and their Aviation. That's a common term in Middle East to combine religion with other things, Including Geography.What's a Jewish Mirage?
However, the numbers are very low, and mostly for show and morale!!!The Iran Aircraft Manufacturing Industrial Company currently produces three aircraft, the Azarakhsh, Saeqeh, and Kowsar, derived from the F-5.
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Well to be honest I'll call utter BS on who ever wrote that, it sounds like some writer's fantasia to sell copy.I read an article, I think in Air Progress in the late 70's, that mentioned the VN F-5 sale as a possibility.
This is true and Iran made their own version of the F-5 a few years ago.By the way, Iran claims they are building new F-5's, but I think in reality it is a rebuild program.
Now compare that to the list of countries outside Nato who flew the F5F-104 operators "outside NATO":
Japan - 198 from 1961-1986
Taiwan - ~244 from 1960-1998
Pakistan - 22 from 1961-1975
Jordan - 36 from 1967-1982
And "inside NATO" was:
USA - 277 from 1958-1975
Canada - 238 from 1961-1986
Germany - 915 from 1960-1991,
Belgium - 112 from 1963-1983,
Netherlands - 138 from 1962-1984,
Italy - 326 from 1963-2004,
Norway - 45 from 1963-1983,
Denmark 51 from 1964-1986,
Greece - 152 from 1964-1993,
Turkey - "just over 400" from 1963-1996,
Spain - 21 from 1965-1972 (the only operator to never lose an airframe)
Note that these totals include many transfers between operators (some airframes having served in 3 or more different nations) and some transferred as spares sources.
The F-5 is a great aircraft. Is it in the same category as an F-16 or F-15? No, of course not, however, it is a capable aircraft that fills a specific need and role as a light and cheap fighter. That is what it was designed to be. Nothing more, and nothing less. It more than fulfills its intended role.
It's like buying a basic model car. You aren't getting all the bells and whistles, but you know that up front. It's great for someone on a budget.
The Iran Aircraft Manufacturing Industrial Company currently produces three aircraft, the Azarakhsh, Saeqeh, and Kowsar, derived from the F-5.
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When I arrived at Moron AB in Spain for Desert Shield in Aug 1990, the Spaniards were still flying a squadron of them on their side of the base. I never saw them at altitude, but down low they could turn-and-burn pretty damned well; their maneuvers were sharp, crisp, and on-point.
I believe they were E models, with two 20mm under the nose, and I bet they could put a hurtin' on a MiG-21 in a straight-up fight. They also had either two or four (I cannot remember any more) Sidewinders, two on tip-rails and perhaps two underwing.
IMHO it would definitely be one of those "it depends on the pilot" encounters.
2 cannons and 2 sidewinders.When I arrived at Moron AB in Spain for Desert Shield in Aug 1990, the Spaniards were still flying a squadron of them on their side of the base. I never saw them at altitude, but down low they could turn-and-burn pretty damned well; their maneuvers were sharp, crisp, and on-point.
I believe they were E models, with two 20mm under the nose, and I bet they could put a hurtin' on a MiG-21 in a straight-up fight. They also had either two or four (I cannot remember any more) Sidewinders, two on tip-rails and perhaps two underwing.
IMHO it would definitely be one of those "it depends on the pilot" encounters.
Yes, and all of those shows and "circus" were for "fanatic" fans of regime! The people that don't know difference between their right and left hands, and can't even speak Persian, properly.Didn't one of them show pics of the cockpit and it looked plastic with a car tape deck/radio in the center of it? Or was that their "Stealth Fighter" that looked like it was manufactured by Hasbro?
If you are going to include Helicopters then I would include two
The Huey and the Sea King, both of which were licenced to other countries and served more of less everywhere.
F104 I wouldn't include. Yes it served in Nato but only very limited penetration elsewhere, I also don't believe it better than the opposition (in a military or commercial manner) and it also lacked reliability.
I would also include the Boeing Vertol C-47 Chinook in that list. I suspect the C-47 is the helicopter with the longest production run in the world - still in production today after more than 60 years!
There were a number of different versions of both aircraft but taking the two main versions The Mig21bis and the F104G in most instances the Mig 21 had the advantage.
The power to weight ratio was better which would help give better acceleration. The wing loading was much lighter which helps with the agility. It should be noted that the difference in these figures was significant, not borderline.
Range was comparable and while the F104 I think had a slight edge in top speed neither of these was going to go far on the afterburner without running out of juice.
In theory the F104 could carry a decent payload in reality both tended to tote a couple of missiles and drop tanks, plus a gun
I would expect the Mig 21 to be able to operate from shorter runways which can help and was reckoned to be easier to handle
Many people underestimate the Mig 21. Often the biggest problem in combat was the training of the crews, not the performance of the aircraft.
Fair observationsI don't think any of these comparative facts between the F-104 and MiG-21 bear much resemblance to reality.
Are you sure about the MiG having a better thrust-to-weight ratio? I'm not.
I doubt very much if the F-104 needed a longer runway compared to the MiG-21, not when they are carrying a comparative payload.
The F-104 certainly had the better range and payload. The Starfighter could certainly carry more than a "couple of missiles" - have you any idea of the type of strike missions the F-104 G was tasked with? Clue, see picture below:
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As for your photo of the F104 equipped for a nuke, how many nukes did Germany have?
One could argue the Huey as well. It has the CH-47 beat by 5 years. Bell technically is still building them in the UH-1Y variant. That is technically a total of 66 years.
As much as I love my Blackhawk, the Huey will still go down as the greatest rotary wing aircraft ever built.
I'd argue the Mi-8 deserves equal status to the Huey. Yes, it's a little younger, but it's still in production and just as prolific (if not more so). On a personal note, it also might be the loudest helicopter I've every had the displeasure of being near.
Worked on Hueys, a little on Mi-8s. The Mi-8 is not a bad machine but it's a size up on the Huey. Quality and ease of maintenance, the Huey hands down! A better comparison is an SH-3 to a Mi-8I'd argue the Mi-8 deserves equal status to the Huey. Yes, it's a little younger, but it's still in production and just as prolific (if not more so). On a personal note, it also might be the loudest helicopter I've every had the displeasure of being near.