"All of Vlad's forces and all of Vlad's men, are out to put Humpty together again." (10 Viewers)

[at6]

I can't help but wonder how POWs are being treated. The Russians are notorious for mistreatment.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

Smart, independently guided termite bombs.

Launched by you-know-who to soften up the target --

 

[SaparotRob]

BRILLIANT! I never would of thought of that. A red white and blue weapon system too. Appropriate.

 

[XBe02Drvr]

So how do you classify those Russians who have protested against this invasion???

Prisoners who may never be seen again.

So neither complicit or complacent (to reference your earlier post)?

Complicit until their protests are effective and Putin is gone. Only results matter.

 

[wlewisiii]

Well, now it seems the source of all our trouble is from Japan...

 

[Dimlee]

introducing any complex armament ssystems is taking months or years before it become real threat for enemy - sorry to say so but giving Ukrainians anything may require more than 8 hours training is pointless

"8 hours training"... Ukraine is fighting for 10 days already.
Poland is the next or one of the next. I hope your politicians do understand that.

 

[SaparotRob]

Well, now it seems the source of all our trouble is from Japan...

It explains a lot.

 

[Admiral Beez]

So how do you classify those Russians who have protested against this invasion???

I omitted the important part in error. Fixed it.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Poland is the next or one of the next. I hope your politicians do understand that.

Wouldn't Moldova be next? They're a breakaway Republic, not in NATO or the EU and are essentially Ukraine Light.

 

[Dimlee]

We are doing those things the best we can. We are already skirting the line.

I really feel for you. Ukraine is being thrown under the bus. I wish it were not so, and I wish more than ever that we could do more. Unfortunately, we have to think of the entire European continent and North America as well. Literally billions of people. It's not that simple.

Of course, it's not simple. But so far the position declared by NATO is simple: we do not interfere.
Simple. Simply stupid. No kind of "ambiguity", a kind that was used towards Taiwan.
This is not an "appeasement" anymore. This is an encouragement. The aggressor now feels free to continue without any fear for his flanks. And he got the signal: NATO is morally weak.

 

[J_P_C]

"8 hours training"... Ukraine is fighting for 10 days already.
Poland is the next or one of the next. I hope your politicians do understand that.

please understand my point - im backing all possible effective help we may deliver to Ukraine - key word here is " effective". Training single soldier in effective use of Javelin or Piorun missiles taking couple hours and both of this weapon system are effective. If Poland will give to Ukraine Mig 29 it is possible to make immediate use of this, the same with 2S1 SP guns or any other well known by Ukrainians equipment - this is as well effective help. Giving to Ukraine complex wepon system they dont know it is not effective help just creating illusions.

 

[GrauGeist]

Wouldn't Moldova be next? They're a breakaway Republic, not in NATO or the EU and are essentially Ukraine Light.

Moldova is a former territory of Romania with a large ethnic Romanian population and as recently as last year, there was talk of reunification.

Russia invading Moldova *may* see Romania becoming involved more than politically.

 

[Dimlee]

please understand my point - im backing all possible effective help we may deliver to Ukraine - key word here is " effective". Training single soldier in effective use of Javelin or Piorun missiles taking couple hours and both of this weapon system are effective. If Poland will give to Ukraine Mig 29 it is possible to make immediate use of this, the same with 2S1 SP guns or any other well known by Ukrainians equipment - this is as well effective help. Giving to Ukraine complex wepon system they dont know it is not effective help just creating illusions.

I do understand your point and thank you for your support. I do not understand the number of hours (days, weeks) as a measure of effectiveness. Imagine Polish pilots in 1940 who are told: no Spitfires for you, never, because the training takes a long time.
Training for the use of complex weapon systems creates not illusions but a firm background for future actions. This is a long war.
And "short term" and "long term" assistance are not mutually exclusive.

 

[Dimlee]

Interesting.
This pilot of Su-30SM says (1:25) that just before his aircraft was hit by two missiles, communication with the base was almost lost.
Probably jamming is still possible.

 

[buffnut453]

This is interesting:

"Lt. Yevgeny Yarantsev of Ukraine said his country's soldiers fight differently than the Russians. The troops under his command organize in small, nimble units that can sneak up on and ambush the lumbering columns of Russian tanks."

Makes me think of the Finns during the Winter War with a modern twist.

"Lt. Dmitry Kovalensky, who had fought in a Russian tank unit and spoke at the behest of his Ukrainian captors, said he recently came under fire from an armed drone and shoulder-launched anti-tank missiles on a road near Sumy in northeastern Ukraine. "The whole column burned," he said.

Around the same time and a few miles away, at a makeshift Ukrainian military base in an abandoned building on the western edge of Kyiv, Ukrainian soldiers prepared for the same sort of ambushes that took out Kovalensky's unit."

Russian Prisoners and Ukrainian Soldiers Describe Two Sides of the Conflict

KYIV, Ukraine — With hands still dirty from the battlefield, a dozen Russian prisoners of war sat, stony-faced, in a conference room of a Ukrainian news agency Saturday and described being captured after their armored columns were ambushed. Lt. Dmitry Kovalensky, who had fought in a Russian tank...

www.yahoo.com

This all points back to lack of accurate planning by the Russian military. I mean, what sort of fight did they think they were getting into? Russia vastly outnumbers Ukraine in terms of outright military power. Did Russian military leaders really expect a big tank battle? Tanks are absolutely useless against an insurgency so why send them into Ukraine….or were they simply supposed to be an overwhelming show of strength that would cow the Ukrainians into surrender? If so, then the tanks would be useful for the victory parade through the streets of Kyiv.

Unfortunately for Moscow, it seems the Ukrainian military refused to be overwhelmed….indeed, they weren't even whelmed. They were distinctly underwhelmed, and adopted tactics that enable them to inflict losses on Russian forces by use of these nimble insurgency tactics. Has the Russian military really forgotten ALL the lessons from their experiences in Afghanistan?

 

[J_P_C]

I do understand your point and thank you for your support. I do not understand the number of hours (days, weeks) as a measure of effectiveness. Imagine Polish pilots in 1940 who are told: no Spitfires for you, never, because the training takes a long time.
Training for the use of complex weapon systems creates not illusions but a firm background for future actions. This is a long war.
And "short term" and "long term" assistance are not mutually exclusive.

actually it has happen - first two polish squadrons have been equipped with Hurricanes because Spitfires as prime equipment has been reserved for british squadrons - it was clear misundersanding of where factor laying - most of the polish pilots have been well trained battle hardened veterans - in british squadrons core of pilots has been kids with 10 to 20 hours in spitfires - first 126 aerial victories of 303 sq has been done with this Hurricanes. Problem is war is now, and we have to think how effectively repeal russians right now - im pretty sure that Ukraine will have access to most of the complex weapon systems as Poland or any other NATO country has. Also im strongly backing Ukraine membership in NATO and EU. All this not just because of my great personal sympathy to Ukraine but also because i strongly believe that it is best we can do for Europe and the world. We may not allow Russia to became superpower. Marshal Pilsudski clearly expressed opinion that for Russia Ukraine is necessary factor for superpower status. Im not biggest fan of Marshal but i think he has been right in this matter.

 

[J_P_C]

Interesting.
This pilot of Su-30SM says (1:25) that just before his aircraft was hit by two missiles, communication with the base was almost lost.
Probably jamming is still possible.

scarry - it was flight wthout any clear orders by statement of pilot - they just treating them as a cannon fodder

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Of course, it's not simple. But so far the position declared by NATO is simple: we do not interfere.
Simple. Simply stupid. No kind of "ambiguity", a kind that was used towards Taiwan.
This is not an "appeasement" anymore. This is an encouragement. The aggressor now feels free to continue without any fear for his flanks. And he got the signal: NATO is morally weak.

Dimlee, I am sure you are thinking with emotion because I know you are a rational and smart man my friend. You know very well what would actually happen if war broke out between the NATO countries and Russia.

 

[SaparotRob]

For what it's worth, I'd be yelling "stop this mental masturbation and stop this evil now! " too, if I were in Dimlee's place.

 

[XBe02Drvr]

You know very well what would actually happen if war broke out between the NATO countries and Russia.

Given the itchiness of a certain trigger finger and the post cold war de-emphasis on ASW, do we know where all the boomers are in real time, and do they all have their "tails"?