b-17

[Dan]

i bet you guys all really don't care but you might want to mention something about the Ju-390: why well it was a German heavy bomber that never got by the prototype stage (let's be thankful for that)

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

but that's true of almost all german prototypes................

 

[cls12vg30]

dont forget lancasters where bombing germany while america was still thinking that it was a great idea to put all their ships in one place and wait for the japs to bomb them all in one go

Hmm..can you say Scapa Flow?

It's not like the U.S. had a huge number of major Pacific bases at the beginning of the war to disperse the Pacific Fleet. Pearl was pretty much it. And it was considered quite safe considering the vast distances seperating it from any hostile force. Which is why the Japanese attack was such a major undertaking, requiring the commitment of nearly all of their carrier assets. No one had ever mounted an aerial attack on that scale over such an extreme distance.

 

[plan_D]

You believe that's an excuse? Never put all your eggs in the same basket.

 

[Dan]

another thing you guys might know is that on the bombers (almost all bombers i should say) when the bay doors opened to release the bombs the plane would be in a extremely exposed position because if there was a good shot to the bomb hold when the bombs were still in there than KABLOOOOEEE!!!!!

 

[Dan]

what i mean is that if there was a good shot to the bomb hold (most likely Ack-Ack) than it would completely destroy the bomber and it would basicly discenigrate

 

[plan_D]

If a 30mm shell hit the fuel tank, it's most likely that it would explode too. Point?

 

[Dan]

yea that would could happen too (and the thing about flak hitting a full bomb bay actually did happen)

 

[Crazy]

You believe that's an excuse? Never put all your eggs in the same basket.

Erm, yes

You'll recall, of course, that all the eggs weren't in the basket... carriers were out to sea. So nananah!

 

[Lightning Guy]

The thin skin covering the bombbay doors wasn't going to make any difference either. Anytime a loaded bombbay was hit it was going to get ugly real fast.

 

[plan_D]

Don't "nananah" me. I'm not Japanese. And they would have been had the Japanese got their a few days earlier. You still had them all stationed in one port..so there...

 

[Lightning Guy]

So where else would you station them? The Philippines were far too exposed and San Deigo was too far to the East to be any sort of deterent to the Japanese.

 

[Erich]

Plan D is correct, put a 2cm M or 3cm M shell into the fuel tanks of any Allied bomber and ....well let your mind wander. Pretty gross and graphic, as the incendiary Minen rounds were actually made to start fires on the aluminum skin of the US B-17's and B-24's..........I have cine-film footage

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

it would apear we have two separate arguments going on here, in all my time on the site, it don't really think i've seen that before.................

 

[HurricaneMkIId]

Hotspace Is Right

 

[plan_D]

You could have stationed them anywhere. You don't stick all your fleet in one port. So...

Pearl Harbour would have been obliterated had Japan sent another wave in. They only did two waves, idiots.

 

[Lightning Guy]

Nagumo probably was overly cautious, but they had achieved far more than they expected and the American defense took a far greater toll on the second wave than on the first. Plus, Nagumo had no idea when the American carriers might show up and they were a threat to his fleet.

 

[plan_D]

He was too cautious... ... ... ... It would be a very big blow had they attacked again.

 

[cls12vg30]

The greatest damage Nagumo could have done with another attack was the destruction of the oil depots around Pearl. That was a vital target that the attack missed. The main goal, destroying battleships, was for the most part achieved. Since the American carriers were not present, from a big-picture perspective, the attack had no chance of success. Battleships were on the way out, carriers on the way in, but few people fully appreciated that at the time.

 

[Lightning Guy]

He also should have attacked the repair facilities. But you have to understand that the Japanese were expecting to suffer heavy losses on the Pearl Harbor mission. They had managed to cripple the Pacific Fleet for the loss of a handful of aircraft and those useless midget subs. It made perfect sense for Nagumo to pull out. Especially since he had no idea where the American carriers were.