Best Fighter in Service Before 1 September 1939

Discussion in 'Polls' started by marshall, Aug 7, 2009.

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Best Fighter in Service Before 1 September 1939

  1. Messerschmitt Bf 109E

    16 vote(s)
    66.7%
  2. Messerschmitt Bf 110C

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Supermarine Spitfire Mk. I

    6 vote(s)
    25.0%
  4. Hawker Hurricane Mk. I

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. Nakajima Ki-27

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  6. Fokker G.1

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  7. Fiat G.50

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. Polikarpov I-16

    1 vote(s)
    4.2%
  9. Morane-Saulnier M.S.406

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. Curtiss P-36 Hawk

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  11. Gloster Gladiator

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  12. Fiat CR.42

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. Seversky P-35

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  14. Brewster Buffalo

    1 vote(s)
    4.2%
  15. Fiat CR.30

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  16. Macchi C.200

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  17. Avia B-534

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  18. Bloch MB.150

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  19. Dewoitine D.500

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  20. Mitsubishi A5M

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  21. PZL P.11

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  22. Other:

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. marshall

    marshall Member

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    Question is simple. What was the best fighter aircraft in service all over the world before the 1 September 1939?

    This question bothers me for some time and I would like to know what other more knowledgeable people than I think about it.

    The term 'best' have for me quite wide meaning, so it don't have to always mean performance.

    Was it the Messerschmitt Bf 109? Or was it something else? Something American, or maybe British, or French, or Italian, or Japanese, or Russian?

    So what is your opinion?
     
  2. Soundbreaker Welch?

    Soundbreaker Welch? Active Member

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    Spitfire or Bf 109? Maybe the Zero?

    Those three seem to be some of the best.
     
  3. davebender

    davebender Well-Known Member

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    The A6M Zero was not yet in service.
     
  4. Soundbreaker Welch?

    Soundbreaker Welch? Active Member

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    #4 Soundbreaker Welch?, Aug 7, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2009
    Ooops, my bad. :oops:

    Well I was looking at the Macchi 202, Mig 3, and D.520, but they came around in 1940.
     
  5. Clay_Allison

    Clay_Allison Active Member

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    Bf 109. All things being equal I'd rather have one than the Spitfire. In 1939 the Bf-109 had 20mm cannons (the E-3 saw service in the Spanish Civil War). The Spitfire had all .303 MG's.

    Planes in service at that time in order of my preference:
    1. Messerschmidt Bf 109E
    2. Supermarine Spitfire
    3. Hawker Hurricane
    4. Messerschmidt Bf 110
    5. Polikarpov I-16
    6. Morane-Saulnier M.S.406
    7. F4F Wildcat
    8. Nakajima Ki-27
    9. Fiat G.50
    10. Fokker D.XXI

    Honorable Mention: P-36 Hawk, Gloster Gladiator, Fiat CR.42, Seversky P-35, Brewster Buffalo, Fokker G.I,
     
  6. Kurfürst

    Kurfürst Banned

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    IMHO its pretty simple - Bf 109E-3. It had variable pitch airscrew (Spits and Hurris had only fixed pitch or two pitch props at the time), cannons and all the rest of the goodies, and above all, it was around in the largest numbers of them all - and it was plenty faster than most at most altitudes. Though at this time, none of the major fighters (except perhaps for I-16?) had cocpit armor fitted yet.
     
  7. Vincenzo

    Vincenzo Active Member

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    F4F was not a 31/08/39 operational fighter same for Buffalo
    1. 109 Emil
    2. Spit
    3. Hurri
    4. Hawk 75
    5. 110C
    6. Ki-27
    7. Fokker G.1
    8. G. 50
    9. I-16
    10 M.S.406

    list of fighters of august '39, maybe some other in minor countries
    (spitfire, hurricane, gladiator, gauntlet, fury, roc, blenheim, P-26, P-35, P-36, FF, F2F, F3F, Ki-10, Ki-27, A4N, A5M, I-15, i-152, I-153, I-16 (until ~type 18), Bf 110C, Bf 109 (until E-3), Spad 510, NiD 622/629, M.S. 406, D.501/510, H.75, Potez 631, C.R. 32, G.50, C.R. 42, P.7, P.11, D XVII, D XXI, G I, Hawk II/III)
     
  8. Waynos

    Waynos Active Member

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    Yes, I would agree that the 109E had the edge on the Spitfire (and those two were head and shoulders above everything else) at that point in history, the Spitfire/109 "who's the best" see-saw was about to begin :)
     
  9. DerAdlerIstGelandet

    DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crew Chief
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    At the start of hostilities in Europe, it is without a doubt the Bf 109E. At that time it had the best combination of armament, speed and maneuverability.
     
  10. Clay_Allison

    Clay_Allison Active Member

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    You are right about the F4F, wrong about the buffalo. my information has the BRewster delivered in April 1939 so...

    Planes in service at that time in order of my preference:
    1. Messerschmidt Bf 109E
    2. Supermarine Spitfire
    3. Hawker Hurricane
    4. Messerschmidt Bf 110
    5. Polikarpov I-16
    6. Morane-Saulnier M.S.406
    7. Nakajima Ki-27
    8. Fiat G.50
    9. Fokker D.XXI
    10. Brewster Buffalo

    In 1939 the Hawk 75 has all of two machine guns on it, one 50 and one 30. That's pathetic, I don't know what you'd be expected to shoot down with that.
     
  11. Vincenzo

    Vincenzo Active Member

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    #11 Vincenzo, Aug 8, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2009
    2 mg in '39 was a common weaponry, but the french hawk75 had 4 7,5 mm (imho is best a .5 and a .30 in nose) (ki-27 G.50 i-16 (not all) and also the orginal buffalo have 2 mgs)

    for buffalo http://www.warbirdforum.com/f2a1.htm
    you can see first delivery to navy 10/06/39 first delivery to squadron 11/12/39
     
  12. michaelmaltby

    michaelmaltby Well-Known Member

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    "..At the start of hostilities in Europe, it is without a doubt the Bf 109E. At that time it had the best combination of armament, speed and maneuverability..."

    " ..the Spitfire/109 "who's the best" see-saw was about to begin.."

    Totally agree. :)

    MM
     
  13. billswagger

    billswagger Member

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    Spitfires and 109Es, but prior to the spitfire, id have to give it to the Hurricane.
     
  14. Clay_Allison

    Clay_Allison Active Member

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    I could forgive the only two MGs if they were at least both .50s
     
  15. FLYBOYJ

    FLYBOYJ "THE GREAT GAZOO"
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    The Hawk 75A did well in French hands against -109 variants during the battle of France. Although we could dispute claims, actual victories and losses, the bottom line is it could compete with the Bf 109E, at least in the manner the LW was operating against this aircraft. From Wiki but I seen other data from what I would call more reliable sources.

    "On 8 September 1939, aircraft from Groupe de Chasse II/4 were credited with shooting down two Luftwaffe Messerschmitt Bf 109Es, the first Allied air victory of World War II on the Western front. During 1939–1940, French pilots claimed 230 confirmed and 80 probable victories in H75s against only 29 aircraft lost in aerial combat. Of the 11 French aces of the early part of the war, seven flew H75s. The leading ace of the time was Lieutenant Edmond Marin la Meslée with 15 confirmed and five probable victories in the type. H75-equipped squadrons were evacuated to French North Africa before the Armistice to avoid capture by the Germans. While under the Vichy government, these units clashed with British aircraft over Mers el-Kébir and Dakar. During Operation Torch in North Africa, French H75s fought against U.S. Navy F4F Wildcats, losing 15 aircraft to seven shot down American planes."
     
  16. Clay_Allison

    Clay_Allison Active Member

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    I guess with french guns the Hawk-75 wasn't bad. Imagine what it would have done with a single 20mm H.S. 404.
     
  17. FLYBOYJ

    FLYBOYJ "THE GREAT GAZOO"
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    Hard to say. It did not have a high powered engine when compared to the 109 but was supposedly quite maneuverable and I think the 109s it came up against tried to dogfight it rather than use "zoom and boom." I don't know what its dive performance was like but I think on take off it was about 1000 pounds lighter than the 109E.
     
  18. Clay_Allison

    Clay_Allison Active Member

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    If you got right on someone's tail in a turn-fight with a 20mm cannon you'd have yourself one dead 109E. The Emil was tough enough to take a few 7.5mm rounds.
     
  19. FLYBOYJ

    FLYBOYJ "THE GREAT GAZOO"
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    IMO the Hawk 75 was the most under rated figher of WW2, at least during the first half.
     
  20. Clay_Allison

    Clay_Allison Active Member

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    You can't dispute that the prewar American armament for it was an unfunny joke though. A .30 and a .50? What? no .22?
     
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