Best Nightfighter of WW2

[mosquitoman]

nice pic, you can see the Schrage Musik. Why didn't the Allies use someting like that?

 

[cheddar cheese]

Nice pic! 8) Cant see the Schrage Musik though...

 

[mosquitoman]

They're on the top of the fuselage- look for a pair of "sticks" pointing upwards

 

[MP-Willow]

So the Ju-88? But that small tight cockpit, how did the tall pilot stand it? And the gu sights outside the plane?

As for the Allied useing the up angled guns I thought it was tried as an experiment but latter dropped? Any help?

 

[Erich]

it wasn't that tight since it could handle four crewmembers in 1945.

none of the sights were outsdie the cockpit. A reflex visor was installed and upward director to fire the Schräge-Musik installation of 1-2 guns.

 

[mosquitoman]

Then again, our nightfighters did more than okay against german bombers and nightfighters

 

[BombTaxi]

One problem with Allied aircraft using Schrage-Musik was that German bombers likt the He111 and Ju88 had ventral guns, which rendered the attack profile suicidal. Oddly, Bomber Command never caught on and never fitted ventral guns to its heavies

 

[mosquitoman]

There was a ventral turret on the Lanc but it was removed to accomodate a larger bombload

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

nice pic erich............

and as for why we didn't use any weapons similar to Schrage Musik, well what would we use them on??

and as for the ventral guns on bomber command aircraft?? our bombers didn't depend on heavy armourment, we used allot of evasive manouvers, the fitting of the ventral turret was heavy, caused a dramatic reduction on manouverability and performance, reduced the payload carrying ability of the lanc, would have prevented the fitting of H2S and well, was really quite ugly.........

 

[BombTaxi]

Good points Lanc, but a simple flexible mount with two .303s would have made Schrage Musik unworkable, as the nightfighter need to formate on the Lanc before firing. It seems that Bomber Command iugnored a very simple solution. And a two-gun flex mount near the wing roots (which is where the SM system was usually aimed would not have interfered with payload, maneuverability of H2S to any significant degree.

 

[Erich]

lanc remember when I quoted on German nf vets message about the Sm installation and attack ?

He would wait for the lancaster in this cast to stop the corkscrew as he was below looking up and followed the lanc through manuvers till the lanc came out of the screw into a flat pattern and then blasted with his 2cm upward guns between the wing root and inboard engine or between two of the engines on one wing with glimmspur-faint tracer and phosphor shells

 

[MP-Willow]

Thanks Eric and all.
I would agree that bomber Comand did remove venteral guns from Lancs and Halifax in favor of he H2S. Also they would have been very helpful I think.

 

[mosquitoman]

Definitely, why not get the bombers bak for another raid. Incidentally some Hallibags had a ventral .303 late in the war

 

[cheddar cheese]

Instead of a manually aimed gun, why not just have a couple of fixed .303's pointing down at an angle? Surely this would have saved space?

 

[BombTaxi]

Fixed guns would have been ineffective as the nf could simply stay outside thier arc of fire. But if the flexible mount had been (for eample, just foward of the bombay (i.e under the cockpit), it would have covered most angles. In fact, it would have made more sense to remove the nose turret (of little use on a nightbomber) and fit a rearward-firing chin mount like the one on the Blenheim IV/V.

 

[KraziKanuK]

BT, the bomb bay ended at the front of the cockpit on the Lanc. Also the turret was above the bomb aimers postion.

 

[BombTaxi]

I'll get me coat...

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

yeah there's no way you'll get a ventral position in the nose of the lanc, there's only just enough space as it is.............

 

[mosquitoman]

Don't worry BT, you make more sense than the Lanc does normally

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

as much as i want to argue that point, i can't......