SaparotRob
Unter Gemeine Geschwader Murmeltier XIII
In times of strife, madness and great upheaval, I find solace in the Groundhog thread.
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In times of strife, madness and great upheaval, I find solace in the Groundhog thread.Aaaaand…..it's Groundhog Day!
These are precisely the discussions that we had with the "expert."
He wanted to remove the nose armour because he thought it was of no use. Alas, he couldn't ever be persuaded to consider the CoG impacts.
That nervous tick has returned to my left cheek. I KNEW resurrecting this thread was a bad idea!
andSpitfire's wings were even thinner, yet people shoved up 4 cannons per an A/C there - so I'd say that P-39's wing was thick enough. How much of the effort Bell's engineers and techincians wanted to invest into modifying the wing for the .50 to fit is another story.
re fitting .50 cal Brownings in the wing (in roughly the same location as the .30 cal Brownings).The P-39D had a 37mm centerline, two cowl mounted .50 MGs and four wing mounted .30 MGs - this could have been modified to omit the two cowl MGs and replace the centerline cannon with a 20mm and replace the four .30 MGs with four .50 MGs
That's siimple!How would you address the resulting CoG issues?
The centerline 37 mm cannon and cowl mounted .50 cal guns are all very far forward and all very heavy items. Unless you can replace all that weight with some other equipment, you will have a seriously tail heavy bird. Just expending the typical 400 rounds of .50 cal in the cowl seemed to be enough to make the aeroplane dangerously unstable.
The Wing guns are pretty near the aircraft CoG, so exchanging the .30 cal guns for .50 cal guns would not move the CoG much assuming they would actually fit into the existing spaces.
The obvious question would be, "What happens when the rather heavy 37 mm cannon gets replaced with a lighter 20 mm gun???"
On factory aircraft that were so equipped, the weight of armour in the nose was increased to maintain balance. Not sure what was done if the cannons were swapped in the field.
- Ivan.
Expending the 37 mm ammunition wasn't that critical. Expending all the .50 cal cowl gun ammunition was a lot worse. It was all a matter of the longer moment arms.
If we take into consideration aircraft technology and design of that point in time, Bell did a fantastic job of creating a fighter that was ahead of it's time.
Several innovations, like tricycle gear, buried engine, centerline cannon, protective armor and unitised construction were cutting edge.
Hmmm...per post #4383, the 50cal ammo was further aft than the 37mm ammo (image repeated below to save scrolling). While I can accept that the 50cal ammo may have weighed more than the 37mm ammo (I don't know....but accepting that at face value for now), the moment arm for the 37mm ammo is smack in the middle between the 2 containers of 50cal ammo so I'm not sure about the "a lot worse" statement. Regardless of the weapon configurations, the P-39 CoG suffered from ammo expenditure...which isn't a good thing.
View attachment 825285
Hmmm...per post #4383, the 50cal ammo was further aft than the 37mm ammo (image repeated below to save scrolling). While I can accept that the 50cal ammo may have weighed more than the 37mm ammo (I don't know....but accepting that at face value for now), the moment arm for the 37mm ammo is smack in the middle between the 2 containers of 50cal ammo so I'm not sure about the "a lot worse" statement. Regardless of the weapon configurations, the P-39 CoG suffered from ammo expenditure...which isn't a good thing.
View attachment 825285
How about if we make the spinner and cannon blast tube from 1/4" armor plate?
That puts mass as far forward as it can possibly go, and doesn't change mass when the ammunition is fired.
We could also fill the tail with a bag containing hydrogen so it would weigh less.....
This is America. We've got helium.We could also fill the tail with a bag containing hydrogen so it would weigh less.....
Our helium embargo on Nazi Germany was the root cause of the Hindenburg disaster. The airship was designed to use helium.This is America. We've got helium.
Just use the non-flammable hydrogen ... you can control the gas flamability with your cell phone and a suitable ap.It should be a fire resistant, armored bag, because the content is, well, hydrogen...
The Germans preferred Sealions.Trained Walrusses? Or wild ones?
When the Europeans arrived on the Plains they found them well wooded and the Buffalo's used to roost in the trees which made them hard to hunt and a falling hazard. Whilst the selective breeding programme slowly reduced the wings it was taking too long so the answer was to clear the forest of the Plains which are bare to this day. This aided the breeding programme by exposing the ungainly winged Buffalo's to more predation. So today the Plains are open and the Buffalo's have lost their wings but we recall their ancient spreading wings in our restaurants.So, that's where Buffalo wings come from.
At least they weren't as troublesome as Australia's Drop Bears.When the Europeans arrived on the Plains they found them well wooded and the Buffalo's used to roost in the trees which made them hard to hunt and a falling hazard.