Ad: This forum contains affiliate links to products on Amazon and eBay. More information in Terms and rules
HiIs there anything Britain could have done between the wars to better prepare the RAF and RN to tackle the ASW needs of 1939-41?
The RN was working on the issue, Sonar - Wikipedia
"The British tested their ASDIC on HMS Antrim in 1920 and started production in 1922. The 6th Destroyer Flotilla had ASDIC-equipped vessels in 1923. An anti-submarine school HMS Osprey and a training flotilla of four vessels were established on Portland in 1924."
Not to me. I don't think H.M.S. Argus or U.S.S. Langley were that much larger (if at all) then most merchantmen. Some of the aircraft in service in the mid thirties could use the shorter flight decks. The use of these ships in ASW training could have sped up development of ASW techniques. Need a faster hull. Need these areas of aircraft performance improved. Etc. The British were using blimps for search missions in WWI (?) so the concept was around.Was an interwar concept of the merchantman converted CVE too outlandish?
Whilst conversions, those were actual, proper fleet carriers though, just small ones. For example, here's HMS Argus sailing with the Royal Navy battlefleet, and USS Langley in port in support of the USN battlefleet.Not to me. I don't think H.M.S. Argus or U.S.S. Langley were that much larger (if at all) then most merchantmen.
There was a lot that had been lost and it took a lot of time to regain it. Often in bitter opposition by elements in the RAF that believe that the RAFs job was to bomb German centers of production and everything else was a distraction at best.What was lost in 1918?
The RN/RNAS had built up a very effective system for tacking U-boats in 1917/18. On 1 April 1918 when the RAF formed there were nearly 3,000 aircraft, 100 airships and 126 coastal stations most of which were dedicated to ASW. And there was the intelligence, command and control systems to back that up. Most of that was undone in the early years of peace only to have to be rebuilt from the mid1930s.
So if some more of this structure could have been retained inter-war Britain would have been better placed in 1939.
The nature of the ASW war expected.
Anson was far from borderline adequate. It was better than using a Puss MothIt was the same with the RAF. The short ranged pre-war Anson, borderline adequate (?) for North Sea operations was being superseded by the Hudson from 1939, but even it did not have adequate range for Atlantic operations. 1941 saw but 10 Liberator GR.1 entering service. It was 1942 before more B-17 & B-24 began to arrive in service to help plug that Atlantic Gap and 1943 before enough really became available.
The gap moved a lot. It was pretty bad in the summer of 1941 however it wasn't that bad in 1940. So the British had about 1 1/2 to two years to get it somewhat under control. Or at least move the Germans further away form the costal areas and into the Atlantic.It was 1942 before more B-17 & B-24 began to arrive in service to help plug that Atlantic Gap and 1943 before enough really became available.
There was a plan to convert a couple of liners into carriers, the ships had been identified and the design work completed. However, when the war started the liners fell into the department responsible for merchant shipping and they wouldn't release them from trooping duties.Was an interwar concept of the merchantman converted CVE too outlandish?
It wasn't until the Americans got into the game that anyone thought about series production of CVEs. I wonder if there were bureaucrats or traditionalists in the RN that blocked the idea between the wars.For some unknown reason no one knocked heads together and there was a delay of a couple of years before the project restarted
There could have been a bunch of blockers and there might have been none.It wasn't until the Americans got into the game that anyone thought about series production of CVEs. I wonder if there were bureaucratic blockers in the RN that blocked the idea between the wars.
While the Keflavik base may have been closed, access to its facilities did not end. And in 2017 US funding was obtained to upgrade its facilities to accommodate the P-8 Poseidon. Work on new hangars, aprons etc began in 2020 and is scheduled to complete next year.I might be influenced by having served in Iceland, but something that could have been done was building an air base there. Having that on day one would be a significant benefit.
The day will come we regret closing NAS Keflavik. Bush 2 closed it down.
In Jan 1941 Eire entered into a secret agreement with Britain to allow RAF aircraft to fly through an agreed air corridor to access the Atlantic via Donegal Bay. There were restrictions to fulfill the needs of Irish neutrality but in practice these were largely ignored by both parties. That became known as The Donegal Corridor and was the shortest route from Northern Ireland to the Atlantic. At the same time an RAF flying boat base was being established at Castle Archdale on Lough Erne. That was the most westerly point in Northern Ireland and Britain. That agreement extended the air coverage in the Atlantic by about 100 miles.We do forget that the French were to (and did prior to the BoF) play a part in the ASW plan and action. Operating from west coast bases. Both in the air and at sea. This would have grown and mutually developed had the Germans been stopped in 1940. The fall of France stretched the Royal Navy into work they never expected to need to cover and air cover would not have had to reach into places like the Bay of Biscay etc. so could concentrate on the western approaches to the UK.
It would have been a nice 'what if' had there been an air base in south western Ireland to extend the effective range of the OTL maritime air cover. Perhaps it could be sweetened by it being an Irish site and Irish run and just having the British pay to use it and only having the operational squadron staff in place. ie the main engineering and support being Irish. Maybe even having it a French site instead to cover the western approaches to France? However that is a whole other thread and this one is no place to go into the idea.