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But what has this to do with the Bf 109E and the Hurricane and my claim that the Hurricane was outclassed by the Bf 109E?
Total losses of aircraft in the Battle of Britain
Month RAF Luftwaffe
July (from10th) 90 165
August 399 612
September 416 554
October 182 321
Total 1087 1652
Total losses by type of aircraft
in the Battle of Britain
Royal Air Force
Type Losses
Hurricane 601
Spitfire 357
Blenheim 53
Other 76
Total 1087
Luftwaffe
Type Losses
Junkers Ju 87 74
Junkers Ju 88 281
Dornier Do 17 171
Dornier Do 215 6
Heinkel He 56 31
Heinkel He 111 246
Heinkel He 115 28
Henschel Hs 126 7
Messerschmitt Bf 109 533
Messerschmitt Bf 110 229
Total 1562
There's no point in degenerating into an argument about which fighter was the best. The Bf 109, Bf 110,Hurricane and Spitfire all had their strengths and weaknesses but they were all competitive.
In certain areas of performance it was in fact superior to the Messerschmitt,particularly with the improved propeller/CSU with which it was fitted by the BoB.
Actually I don't want a dicussion about the Hurricane and the Bf 109E, I only wanted to argument that the I-16 is clearly inferior to the Bf 109E!
After my informations are this the losses from air to air combat with fighters!
The RAF had lost about 1200 a/c's at BoB and the kill ratio of the german bombers were near nil!
Judging from the number one might get the impression that a bf 109 was the unhealthiest plane to fly on the German side
What was it? Liars, damn liars and....?
Chrzzzz
it's true that we have not a work as "the BoF then and now" for the BoB but see the results of Hurricane in France and MTO vs 109, with the historical crews, the Hurry is inferior, as fighter, to 109, obviously this is only my opinion.
Not only that it did a lousy job of protecting the bombers.
it's true that we have not a work as "the BoF then and now" for the BoB but see the results of Hurricane in France and MTO vs 109, with the historical crews, the Hurry is inferior, as fighter, to 109, obviously this is only my opinion.
What are the conditions to be a good gun platform?OK but that tendency implies that the I-16 probably wouldn't make a very good gun platform.
I do not blame you for anything, but men that wrote books about I-16 as Keith Dexter, Green, Swanborough etc...and recieved money for that and supposingly being qualified specs ignored or even never understood the difference, yet evident between unstability, and lack of stability.I'm no pilot and I have never flown any plane.
The I-16 was at least no novice aircraft, It was overly sensitive to control mouvements and the inertia moments around all three axes was extremely small. The CG coincided with the centre of pressure so longitidinal stability was marginal.i have to do with the statements from men who did (do, since here are some convincing reissues). Golodnikov claims that the 1-16 ''was a complicated aircraft, demanding in piloting technique. It could fall into a spin at the slightest "overhandling'. He says he liked that. I can imagine pilots who wouldn't.
Well actually that is not false. The I-180 was not taken in production which is all that i claimed. According to wiki a couple of testpilots lost their lives and another prefered to bail out in stead of landing. Either don't make for a good reputation. Besides that I won't dispute there were political reasons aswell. But if the production of the I-180 did not get of the ground in real history there is no reason why it should in our altered scenario.
What are the conditions to be a good gun platform?
What is wrong with "The BoB Then and Now Mark V"? The main authors are same. OK the BoBT&N is older but still.
Juha
The Hurricanes flying in the BoB were not the same as those flying in the BoF.
I've already mentioned the CSU,there was also 100 Octane fuel available,doubling the allowable supercharger boost pressure to 12 lbs.
in mto they flying also most "advanced" hurry and the combat results are bad.
It struggled to compete with the "Friedrich",but that's not what it was up against in the summer/autumn of 1940.
The F series of 109s were a significant improvement on the E series both aerodynamically and in engine power. The Hurricane,coming at the end of a developmental line,was not capable of such development. In the last months of 1940 and into 1941 it was at a disadvantage against the new Bf 109 F,a point I agreed to several posts back.