On the deck or Russia pushing buttons.

Discussion in 'Aviation Videos' started by Torch, Apr 14, 2016.

  1. Torch

    Torch Well-Known Member

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  2. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    Yeah...that was an incredibly stupid and reckless move on Russia's behalf.

    There's a great deal of sentiment out there, however, that insists that Russia was justified in doing that because the Missile Frigate was "near Russian" territory. Had this actually been the case, Russia could have (and has) asked the U.S. warships to move off. Unfortunately, this is not the first time that Russians have buzzed U.S. warships (notice they don't buzz other nation's warships?) and eventually, something will go terrible wrong.

    I might also mention that Russian warships not only sail along U.S. territorial waters, but occasionally cross in and out of territorial waters near Alaska. And U.S. warplanes do not buzz them.
     
  3. mikewint

    mikewint Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget the Ka-27 Russian helo that hovered right over the ship taking pics
    n7xcz2b9pryytthwvqgo.jpg
     
  4. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    Would have been interesting if the helo's cameraman realized the Phalinx barrels were pointed directly at them...
     
  5. Crimea_River

    Crimea_River Well-Known Member

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  6. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    Yes, that was certainly close (circling and approaching within 500 meters) and reckless, but the Russians have this penchant for getting right on top of U.S. warships. The USS Cook incident back in 2014 is a good example, the aggressive behavior of the Russian jet almost prompted the skipper to use counter-measures.

    Which is not nearly as bad as their habit of getting right on top of aircraft (all nationalities). While the Russians seem to enjoy harassing U.S. assets, it seems that the Swedes are the ones who the Russians routinely harass the most with over-flights, incursions and submarine shenanigans...not sure why, perhaps they hate Jan's accent? :lol:
     
  7. ROSS_BerryMORE

    ROSS_BerryMORE New Member

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    What american ships do near russian border? They didnt have enough space near own coast?
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  8. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    The USS Cook was off the coast of Poland, as it had just left port of Gdynia

    Last year, the Russians and Chinese held naval excercises within 90 miles of the Florida coast. U.S. warplanes did not behave in such a reckless manner because there were no overflights or approaches by U.S. military, only a courtesy notice by U.S. Coast Guard that they have ships and aircraft in the area. When Russian bombers and fighters fly along the west coast of the U.S., they are escorted away from U.S. territory in a professional manner, not "hazed" like the Russian pilots like to do, on some occasions approaching aircraft within meters, creating a VERY dangerous situation.
     
  9. Gnomey

    Gnomey World Travelling Doctor
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    Certainly Russia trying to push buttons and see what happens. Wouldn't be ideal if it ended badly though which may happen if it continues...
     
  10. mikewint

    mikewint Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps there is more to this incident than simple harasment. This is being widely posted on several sites:
    The Russian Su-24 that buzzed the USS Donald Cook carried neither bombs nor missiles but only a basket mounted under the fuselage, which, according to the Russian newspaper Rossiyskaya Gazeta, contained a Russian electronic warfare device called Khibiny.
    As the Russian jet approached the US vessel, the electronic device disabled all radars, control circuits, systems, information transmission, etc. on board the US destroyer. In other words, the all-powerful Aegis system, now hooked up - or about to be - with the defense systems installed on NATO’s most modern ships was shut down, as turning off the TV set with the remote control.
    The Russian Su-24 then simulated a missile attack against the USS Donald Cook, which was left literally deaf and blind. As if carrying out a training exercise, the Russian aircraft - unarmed - repeated the same maneuver 12 times before flying away.

    The USS Donald Cook was sailing in international waters in the Baltic Sea 70 nautical miles (130km) off Kaliningrad. By International Law, each coastal State may claim a territorial sea that extends seaward up to 12 nautical miles (nm) from its baselines. The coastal State exercises sovereignty over its territorial sea, the air space above it, and the seabed and subsoil beneath it. Foreign flag ships enjoy the right of innocent passage while transiting the territorial sea subject to laws and regulations adopted by the coastal State that are in conformity with the Law of the Sea Convention and other rules of international law relating to such passage. The U.S. claimed a 12 nm territorial sea in 1988.
    In addition, each coastal State may claim a contiguous zone adjacent to and beyond its territorial sea that extends seaward up to 24 nm from its baselines. In its contiguous zone, a coastal State may exercise the control necessary to prevent the infringement of its customs, fiscal, immigration or sanitary laws and regulations within its territory or territorial sea, and punish infringement of those laws and regulations committed within its territory or territorial sea. Additionally, in order to control trafficking in archaeological and historical objects found at sea, a coastal State may presume that their removal from the seabed of the contiguous zone without its consent is unlawful.
    In 1972, the U.S. proclaimed a contiguous zone extending from 3 to 12 miles offshore, consistent with the 1958 UN Convention on the Territorial Sea and Contiguous Zone. In 1999, eleven years after President Reagan extended the U.S. territorial sea to 12 miles, President Clinton proclaimed a contiguous zone extending from 12 to 24 nm offshore, consistent with Article 33 of the Law of the Sea Convention.
     
  11. Torch

    Torch Well-Known Member

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    The zapping of radar was rumored earlier this year or last year,I don't know if this is the same situation as a few days ago. Same ship thou.
     
  12. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    Mike, this most recent incident involved 2 Su-24 and a Helicopter filming everything

    I haven't heard about this mystery "basket" on this occasion, but I saw the rumors of the AEGIS being jammed in the Black Sea incident pop up on .ORG conspiracy sites after an article surfaced on RT-dot-com (Russia Today).
     
  13. Torch

    Torch Well-Known Member

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  14. mikewint

    mikewint Well-Known Member

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    As I read it, it is the same incident. No way to confirm one way or an other. Also explains the 12 passes. Checking to see if the system was going to come back on line?
     
  15. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    That story they ran is a reprint...and several key items I might point out:

    Refer to my previous post in regards to this statement:
    "Pavel Zolotarev, Deputy Director, Institute of USA and Canada, shares details about this version which is being actively discussed in the Russian media and by bloggers."

    This next statement is a glaring spin as there is always a rotation of U.S. warships (typically Destroyers, occasionally Frigates) in the black sea - the Cook was on rotation there and happened to be heading to Constantia, Romania when the unarmed Su-24 did a flyby:
    "US destroyer “Donald Cook” with cruise missiles “Tomahawk” entered the neutral waters of the Black Sea on April 10. The purpose was a demonstration of force and intimidation in connection with the position of Russia in Ukraine and Crimea. The appearance of American warships in these waters is in contradiction of the Montreux Convention about the nature and duration of stay in the Black Sea by the military ships of countries not washed by this sea."

    It goes on to say that frightened U.S. sailors jumped ship once it reached port, being terrified:
    "After the incident, the foreign media reported that “Donald Cook” was rushed into a port in Romania. There all the 27 members of the crew filed a letter of resignation. It seems that all 27 people have written that they are not going to risk their lives. This is indirectly confirmed by the Pentagon statement according to which the action demoralized the crew of the American ship."
    Which is not how U.S. sailors behave. And yes, the Cook put into Romania because it was scheduled to do so. It also had ports of call in Varna, Bulgaria and later, Turkey.

    If the languange and "feel" of the article sounds a little Russian, it's because it is. This interesting article first appeared as a report by RT and was picked up by everybody else, with no sources or citations.

    Interestingly enough, there was a statement on KRET's website that said that the Su-24 involved in the incident did not have thier Khibiny ES installed and went on to say: "however the it would be capable of neutralizing it, if it had been".
    KRET is the manufacturer of Russian electronic warfare systems...

    So I don't put much stock in any of that.
     
  16. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    I also forgot to mention a few things.

    The first, which may help clarify some confusion: the USS Cook was involved in both incidents, this most recent in the Baltic and the incident in the Black Sea in 2014.

    The other point, is that we've seen how "news" sources love to regurgitate atricles and I'll use the F-35 saga as a prime example. There is nothing credible about RT and it provides a great deal of fantasy for bloggers worldwide. What also made me made as hell, is that RT (and other sites that borrowed their slobber) was making fun of Donald Cook. He was a POW in Vietnam who died in captivity and the ship was named in his honor. That the site VeteranTimes actually repeated "Donald Duck" in the title for their piece should earn the editor a throat-punch.

    And lastly, if the AEGIS systems was found to be flawed, you can be sure that the Navy would put the Cook up for upgrades and not keep her active, especially in a region where the system was being repeately tested by the Russian's shenanigans.
     
  17. mikewint

    mikewint Well-Known Member

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    #17 mikewint, Apr 16, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2016
    Yea, I caught all that crepe as well and the Donald DUCK reference, A-wipes
    DONALD GILBERT COOK
    In 1956 he enlisted in the Marine Corps as a private but was quickly sent for officer training at the OCS in Quantico, Vieginia. He was commissioned a second lieutenant in 1957. He held a series of assignments in the Marine Corps and was sent to Vietnam in late 1964, where he served as an advisor to the Vietnamese Marine Division until he was wounded and captured by the Viet Cong several weeks later. He was held as a Prisoner of war by the Viet Cong in the Republic of Vietnam from December 31, 1964 until his death from malaria at age 33. He was posthumously promoted from Captain to Colonel. Although his body was never recovered, his grave can be found in the Memorial Section MI Lot 110.
    His MOH Citation
    For conspicuous gallantry and intrepidity at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty while interned as a Prisoner of War by the Viet Cong in the Republic of Vietnam during the period 31 December 1964 to 8 December 1967. Despite the fact that by so doing he would bring about harsher treatment for himself, Colonel (then Captain) Cook established himself as the senior prisoner, even though in actuality he was not. Repeatedly assuming more than his share of responsibility for their health, Colonel Cook willingly and unselfishly put the interests of his comrades before that of his own well-being and, eventually, his life. Giving more needy men his medicine and drug allowance while constantly nursing them, he risked infection from contagious diseases while in a rapidly deteriorating state of health. This unselfish and exemplary conduct, coupled with his refusal to stray even the slightest from the Code of Conduct, earned him the deepest respect from not only his fellow prisoners, but his captors as well. Rather than negotiate for his own release or better treatment, he steadfastly frustrated attempts by the Viet Cong to break his indomitable spirit and passed this same resolve on to the men whose well-being he so closely associated himself. Knowing his refusals would prevent his release prior to the end of the war, and also knowing his chances for prolonged survival would be small in the event of continued refusal, he chose nevertheless to adhere to a Code of Conduct far above that which could be expected. His personal valor and exceptional spirit of loyalty in the face of almost certain death reflected the highest credit upon Colonel Cook, the Marine Corps, and the United States Naval Service.
    MISTER Donald Duck to you Tiny-Brained-Wipers-of-Other-Peoples-Behinds
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  18. Torch

    Torch Well-Known Member

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  19. Torch

    Torch Well-Known Member

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  20. ROSS_BerryMORE

    ROSS_BerryMORE New Member

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    GNOMEY you really ridiculous.
    Yes it`s RUSSIA of cause tried to push all buttons, like turkish f-16.
    Why Russia Resents Us
     
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