The Few

[SaparotRob]

I know. I couldn't wait on The Admiral any longer. The suspense was killing me.

 

[GrauGeist]

If I remember right, most European nations practice aircraft dispersal with highways being interim operational "fields".

 

[Admiral Beez]

I know. I couldn't wait on The Admiral any longer. The suspense was killing me.

Me? I have no comment on the nukes.

 

[SaparotRob]

Just kidding.

 

[MiTasol]

I do hope the West has shut down Russia's access to their network of GPS satellites.

The Russians have their own GPS system which is quite comprehensive in that area

 

[MiTasol]

The Nukes are gone. The Budapest Agreement in 2004 signed by the US, UK, and Russia guaranteed Ukraine's defense and security if they gave up the nukes.

We see what Putin thinks of the agreement.

The same as the Chinese honour the Hong Kong agreements

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

The same as the Chinese honour the Hong Kong agreements

Russia certainly is not honoring the Budapest Agreement.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Russia certainly is not honoring the Budapest Agreement.

Lethal aid and unprecedented sanctions aside, the Ukrainians might argue that the US isn't either.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Lethal aid and unprecedented sanctions aside, the Ukrainians might argue that the US isn't either.

They do have an argument, unfortunately. Hense why I said in the other thread they were somewhat being thrown under the bus.

I understand why the Agreement was signed, and I suspect that all parties new it was on paper only because NATO will never risk war with Russia. Too much is at stake.

 

[stona]

The Nukes are gone. The Budapest Agreement in 2004 signed by the US, UK, and Russia guaranteed Ukraine's defense and security if they gave up the nukes.

We see what Putin thinks of the agreement.

The Budapest Memorandum didn't offer security guarantees, it offered certain assurances to the nations concerned when they agreed to give up nuclear weapons on their territories.

Article four is most relevant. The signatories agreed to Seek immediate Security Council action to provide assistance to Belarus, Kazakhstan or Ukraine if they "should become a victim of an act of aggression or an object of a threat of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used". That is a long way from a security guarantee and even further from any kind of mutual defence pact.

It's a worthless piece of paper, torn up by the Russian Federation.

The current problem is that Putin has made a gamble and is losing. When a gambler has already lost so much that he will go bankrupt unless he can turn it around, the logical thing for him to do is to continue upping the stakes. This is the desperate opponent the West may now face. The trick is to give Putin a way out without humiliating him and Russia, whilst being seen to save Ukraine's territorial integrity. It will be a difficult trick to pull off, and the stakes are very high. If Putin is to accept a negotiated defeat, he will require a fig leaf to hide the reality that he has failed to subdue Ukraine.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

The Budapest Memorandum didn't offer security guarantees, it offered certain assurances to the nations concerned when they agreed to give up nuclear weapons on their territories.

Article four is most relevant. The signatories agreed to Seek immediate Security Council action to provide assistance to Belarus, Kazakhstan or Ukraine if they "should become a victim of an act of aggression or an object of a threat of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used". That is a long way from a security guarantee and even further from any kind of mutual defence pact.

It's a worthless piece of paper, torn up by the Russian Federation.

The current problem is that Putin has made a gamble and is losing. When a gambler has already lost so much that he will go bankrupt unless he can turn it around, the logical thing for him to do is to continue upping the stakes. This is the desperate opponent the West may now face. The trick is to give Putin a way out without humiliating him and Russia, whilst being seen to save Ukraine's territorial integrity. It will be a difficult trick to pull off, and the stakes are very high. If Putin is to accept a negotiated defeat, he will require a fig leaf to hide the reality that he has failed to subdue Ukraine.

I always understand it as security guarantees. I agree its worthless though.

 

[Escuadrilla Azul]

The current problem is that Putin has made a gamble and is losing. When a gambler has already lost so much that he will go bankrupt unless he can turn it around, the logical thing for him to do is to continue upping the stakes. This is the desperate opponent the West may now face. The trick is to give Putin a way out without humiliating him and Russia, whilst being seen to save Ukraine's territorial integrity. It will be a difficult trick to pull off, and the stakes are very high. If Putin is to accept a negotiated defeat, he will require a fig leaf to hide the reality that he has failed to subdue Ukraine.

I hope that Putin will accept such a agreement if it could be done but I doubt he will.

 

[Admiral Beez]

The air force upgrade program was, unfortunately, delayed and then postponed. There were talks about F-16 and Gripen.

I wonder how the Ukranians would have done with the economy fighters and fast trainers, like the HAL Tejas and IAR-99 Soim. A Ukranian FA-50 Golden Eagle would be exciting to see. At US$30 million a pop, that's pretty economical.

 

[Admiral Beez]

This is very well made.

"All of Vlad's forces and all of Vlad's men, are out to put Humpty together again."

I saw in the thread the question as to what can be done to support the Ukrainians in Mariupol. (which I believe is of utmost importance in order to prevent the Russians from cutting off the Ukrainians) Then one chap brought in Airdrop supplies. next was, do the Ukrainians have such aircraft's...

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