The Greatest Fighter Pilot in WW II???

[Erich]

hmmmmmmmmm did you know that Hartmann could not of scored his 352 without the watchful eye of his youthful wingman who himself scored over 100 victories ? Marseilles kills of 17 in a day are not certain neither are the 222 of Erich Rudorffer. I do wonder how the star of Afrika and the blonde knoight would of faired in combat with US heavy bombers and the scores of P-51's, and yes I know about hartmann's claims agasint p-51's of the 15th AF..... it is rather amazing though to think of over 11,000 kills alone scored by JG 52 that Rall, Barkhorn, and Hartmann were part of during their long careers.....

best pilot either goes to the German night fighter aces or the day fighter boyz agasint 4 enigne bombers/escorts, without a doubt the toughest flying during the whole war.

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[lesofprimus]

Yea LG, I have seen some pics and some illustrations showing the tail markers... But I have never seen Hartmanns....

Erich, do u happen to have a pic laying around somewhere???

And yes, a wingman is a very important part of the game... Hartmann never lost a wingman to enemy fighter action either...

 

[kiwimac]

Here is an early pciture of Hartmann + his Me109 with 100+ kills

http://www.adlertag.de/asse/hartmann.htm



All I can find so far.

Kiwimac

 

[kiwimac]

Here is an early pciture of Hartmann + his Me109 with 100+ kills

http://www.adlertag.de/asse/hartmann.htm



All I can find so far.

Kiwimac

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

he looks like he belongs in a barbor shop.................

 

[Erich]

great pic Kiwimac. I've got one pic of Hartmann's wingman so I will try and find it. think he is sitting upright out of the cockpit with a profile of his face looking into the wind.............I'll do a little bio on him once I find his pic.

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[The Jagdflieger Pips]

I have a model of his plane when he had that painted on. =3 Great picture.

 

[lesofprimus]

Great Pic Kiwi... Now if we can find one with the 300 in wreath we'd be n Bidness...

What would u can those markings... Im having trouble findin somethin on search...

Kill markings???

 

[Erich]

they would be called victory markings on the rudder. in fact there is an old book OOP on German rudder markings... produced by Schiffer pubs on the east coast of the good ol USof A

 

[lesofprimus]

Heres a statue of Marseille and his rudder...

 

[lesofprimus]

Heres one at 50...

 

[lesofprimus]

Hers a good shot for U Brits...

 

[GermansRGeniuses]

Here is Kozhedubs La-7, which he flew from April 1945 till the end of hostilities...

And another here that i added to library...

That's no La-7... (In the top profile)


That there is an La-5 (F? Fn?)! You can tell because the cockpit on the La-7 fairs straight into the rear fuselage, unlike in the La-5's, where it was humped...

 

[lesofprimus]

that was the file name i downloaded...

I agree it is a -5 not a -7...

 

[lesofprimus]

And for the record, I think that, while 352 kills is unreal, Hartmanns opposition was so sub par, and his luck so very high, that its not a great way to detemine this...

Kozhedub had to fly against some serious opposition... In an inferior aircraft...

If any German pilot should get it, it would have to be in the WTO... The competition was so much more balanced...

Who were the leading WTO Germans???

 

[lesofprimus]

GERMANY
* means dead

Erich Hartmann 352
Gerhard Barkhorn 301
Guenther Rall 275
* Otto Kittel 267
Theodore Weissenberger 252
Wilhelm Batz 237
Erich Rudorffer 222
Heinrich Bar 221
* Heinrich Ehrler 220
Hermann Graf 212
Johannes Weise 208
* Hans Philip 206
Walter Schuck 206
Anton Hafner 204
Helmut Lipfert 203
Walter Krupinski 197
Anton Hackl 192
* Maximilian Stotz 189
Joachim Brendel 189
* Joachim Kirschner 188
Kurt Hans Friedrich Brandle 180
Guenther Josten 178
Johannes Steinhoff 178-176
*Albin Wolf 176
Ernst-Wilhelm Reinert 174
Gunther Schack 174
*Emil Lang 173
*Heinz Johnny Schmidt 173
*Horst Adameit 166
*Wolf-Dietrich Wilke 162
*Hans-Joachim Marseille 158
*Heinrich Sturm 158
Gerhard Thyben 157
*Hans Beiswenger 152
Peter Duettmann 152
Gordon Gollob 150

 

[lesofprimus]

And what about ratio of Fighter kills to bomber kills???

 

[Lightning Guy]

Well, shooting down a Battle or Blenhim wasn't that hard. But knocking a B-17 or B-24 out of a combat box was a very risky proposition.

 

[lesofprimus]

I agree...

 

[Erich]

before I konk off for a Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz and an early start to work, what are U guys/gals interested in concerning bomber kills by Luftwaffe fighters ? names and numbers of victories or ? this is a subject I am well acquainted with for the last 35 + years

E ~