What happened to bullets that missed in Aerial Battles?

[ThomasP]

 

[Koopernic]

Not necessarily. A typical spitzer-type rifle/MG bullet has its C of G quite far back, so is inherently unstable when flying point-first. But it is relatively stable when flying base-first. So if it is fired absolutely vertically, at the moment that it stops and begins to fall, it may continue to fall base-first, achieving a higher terminal velocity than if it was tumbling.

There is a data table in the NRA Firearms Fact Book (a useful compendium of miscellaneous information) which gives the terminal velocity of a vertically-fired 180 grain PSP .30 cal bullet depending on whether it falls point first (450 fps), base first (320 fps), or is tumbling (180 fps).

It's enough for a man to give up and just want to shoot flechettes or slugs.

 

[pbehn]

Not necessarily. A typical spitzer-type rifle/MG bullet has its C of G quite far back, so is inherently unstable when flying point-first. But it is relatively stable when flying base-first. So if it is fired absolutely vertically, at the moment that it stops and begins to fall, it may continue to fall base-first, achieving a higher terminal velocity than if it was tumbling.

There is a data table in the NRA Firearms Fact Book (a useful compendium of miscellaneous information) which gives the terminal velocity of a vertically-fired 180 grain PSP .30 cal bullet depending on whether it falls point first (450 fps), base first (320 fps), or is tumbling (180 fps).

Any solid, round piece of metal with a point at one end and flat end at the other will have the centre of mass behind its mid point but not by much. Where the centre of gravity for these is a question to be answered as spent rounds. (from wiki)

 

[yulzari]

I use 19th century military rifles and have closely studied period literature on their use. I find myself amused to see an ongoing discussion which mirrors that of nigh on 200 years ago which was agreed then to have come to the conclusion that a rifled conical (in the parlance of the day) bullet travels along a parabolic path and the point remains following the parabola, thus points down when it reaches the end of it's flight. I doubt if the rules of the universe have changed much since then.

 

[Graeme]

(QI - 2012)

 

[gordonm1]

I have experienced .30 caliber ball ammo tumbling before reaching the target at 1000 yards. Bullet stability is affected when the velocity passes through the speed of sound even if it still has rotation. .50 caliber might not tumble fired from 5000 feet but .30 caliber probably would. I know I can't hit the target with my garand at 1000 yards.

 

[tyrodtom]

I have experienced .30 caliber ball ammo tumbling before reaching the target at 1000 yards. Bullet stability is affected when the velocity passes through the speed of sound even if it still has rotation. .50 caliber might not tumble fired from 5000 feet but .30 caliber probably would. I know I can't hit the target with my garand at 1000 yards.

The longest range confirmed kill with a 7.62x51 is a 1250 meters, over 1300 yards.
The .30 06 is generally considered just as accurate.

 

[gordonm1]

The longest range confirmed kill with a 7.62x51 is a 1250 meters, over 1300 yards.
The .30 06 is generally considered just as accurate.

That was probably a bolt gun with long range bullets and slower powder that can make higher velocity. My Lake City match was chronographing about 2500 fps for a 172 grain bullet using faster powder for the gas action in the garand. 1300 yards is 3900 feet, less than the 5000 I mentioned.

 

[special ed]

Bullet shape is important. A boat tail bullet will be accurate longer than a flat base bullet.

 

[GregP]

I am frequently amused by people talking about energy maneuvering of fighter aircraft in WWII. The concept wasn't around at the time, and didn't gain much acceptance until the late 1960s. It is basically fighter kinetic energy and the subject is maneuvering in the vertical plane, but dogfighting didn't really go there much during WWII unless one of the opponents was flying a plane with an outstanding rate of climb. Then, it wasn't so much using KE as it was using your plane's strengths.