"Why is there a Bucket on your nose Mr. DOODLEBUG??"

Blixie · Dec 18, 2020

Koopernic said:
The nose distance measuring turbine could be used to drive an odograph to provide navigation. I imagine the pilots weren't going to be great navigators and would use the auto-pilot most of the way.

Is there anything in the manual about the compartments that could discharge propaganda leaflets? Ive always though the V1 would be a useful way of discharging windows/chaff

Got this from

Koopernic said:
You may need to start a new post and attach there. I found I couldn't attach in an edit on occasion. Maybe close and reopen your browser and make sure you are logged in.

Thanks, there it was

GrauGeist · Dec 18, 2020

xylstra said:
Not by my reading of the thoroughly comprehensive biography on Sperry. There was much cross-fertilisation between the three American drone projects due to the personnel involved but either way, you can be sure the V-1 designers didn't reference Kettering's work. They had inspiration much closer to home originating in WW1 drone missile work with Zeppelin's as the carrier.

Sperry had been experimenting with aircraft loaded with dynamite (Curtiss N-9 aircraft, to be exact), Kettering brought together a group to make his concept a reality.
So tell me what the difference between the "Bug" and the V-1 was.
Both were built around an explosive, which had wings attached and a means of propulsion.
Both had a gyroscope for guidance along with a device to measure distance, which automatically shut off the engine at the preset point.

The gyroscope in the V-1 was the patented invention of Sperry, who also provided the guidance system for the Bug.

Several sources, including Jane's, USAF and US Army history archives, etc. consider Kettering's project to be the world's first cruise missile - predating the V-1 by twenty years.

xylstra · Dec 18, 2020

GrauGeist said:
Sperry had been experimenting with aircraft loaded with dynamite (Curtiss N-9 aircraft, to be exact), Kettering brought together a group to make his concept a reality.
So tell me what the difference between the "Bug" and the V-1 was.
Both were built around an explosive, which had wings attached and a means of propulsion.
Both had a gyroscope for guidance along with a device to measure distance, which automatically shut off the engine at the preset point.

The gyroscope in the V-1 was the patented invention of Sperry, who also provided the guidance system for the Bug.

Several sources, including Jane's, USAF and US Army history archives, etc. consider Kettering's project to be the world's first cruise missile - predating the V-1 by twenty years.

The Antikythera astronomical computer pre-dated European clock-making by 1-1/2 millenia but if I follow your logic you seem to infer that they must have copied it. Nonsense - it was lying in state, undiscovered on the sea-bed! Being first doesn't qualify you for a medal if it's a failure, the V-1 was anything but. Ask the people on the receiving end if you don't believe me.

Jimbob · Dec 18, 2020

From the U.S. Manual on German Ordnance.

GrauGeist · Dec 18, 2020

xylstra said:
The Antikythera astronomical computer pre-dated European clock-making by 1-1/2 millenia but if I follow your logic you seem to infer that they must have copied it. Nonsense - it was lying in state, undiscovered on the sea-bed! Being first doesn't qualify you for a medal if it's a failure, the V-1 was anything but. Ask the people on the receiving end if you don't believe me.

So you're trying to infer that the V-1 was a completely original idea?
That the concept of putting wings and an engine on a bomb was a brilliant idea someone at Feisler had?
And so, of course, the gyroscope and distance measuring idea must have been an original idea of theirs too...those crafty Germans!

xylstra · Dec 18, 2020

Jimbob said:
From the U.S. Manual on German Ordnance.

Top notch JimBob - well done!

Koopernic · Dec 18, 2020

xylstra said:
The Antikythera astronomical computer pre-dated European clock-making by 1-1/2 millenia but if I follow your logic you seem to infer that they must have copied it. Nonsense - it was lying in state, undiscovered on the sea-bed! Being first doesn't qualify you for a medal if it's a failure, the V-1 was anything but. Ask the people on the receiving end if you don't believe me.

In 1904 Dr. Hermann Anschütz-Kaempfe invented the north seeking gyrocompass which precesses to true north. It was a stupendous invention.
History | Raytheon Anschütz (raytheon-anschuetz.com)

In 1912 Dr. Hermann Anschütz-Kaempfe proposed that gyros be used for course holding of anything that required it. Elmer Sperry proposed the same thing at the same time though it was his son Lawrence that implemented it.
The origin of the autopilot (aertecsolutions.com)

"It was in 1912 that the American inventor Elmer Ambrose Sperry and the German physicist Hermann Anschütz-Kaempfe proposed a system that would allow any moving vehicle to maintain a certain course. Its operation was based on connecting one or more gyroscopes and a compass to the control elements of the vehicle in question."

We also have the Whitehead torpedo which used a gyro. Here is an 1896 gyro from a USN Whitehead Torpedo.
NH 84483 Torpedo Gyro (navy.mil)

I dont think you can attribute Sperry having a great earth shattering breakthrough. He merely applied existing technology to aircraft. Other people had that technology as well and others applied it as well or proposed it. I also don't think the V1 relied on Sperry. He wasnt they only one pointing the way. German autopilots were electrical (Siemens and Patin) wheras the US and British stuff was a lot more pneumatic in nature. The V1 autopilot was engineered to a price.

K5083 · Dec 20, 2020

This may not help much, but there's a movie about the Loon. Glenn Ford is a sub captain who is involved with the project to launch from subs. He supervises the ramp building, borrows Loons for the Army and eventually, after various setbacks and falling in lust with Viveca Lindfors, the Admiral's secretary.

Anyhow, in the final test loons launched by one sub group fly towards the exercise target carrier group and are passed on to a second group of subs who take control of the Loons and issue final course corrections. That's more capability than I knew the thing had.

The movie is 'The Flying Missile', 1950. It's been on a classic TV channel here lately.

Blixie · Dec 20, 2020

K5083 said:
This may not help much, but there's a movie about the Loon. Glenn Ford is a sub captain who is involved with the project to launch from subs. He supervises the ramp building, borrows Loons for the Army and eventually, after various setbacks and falling in lust with Viveca Lindfors, the Admiral's secretary.

Anyhow, in the final test loons launched by one sub group fly towards the exercise target carrier group and are passed on to a second group of subs who take control of the Loons and issue final course corrections. That's more capability than I knew the thing had.

The movie is 'The Flying Missile', 1950. It's been on a classic TV channel here lately.

The entire movie can be seen on Youtube.

xylstra · Dec 22, 2020

K5083 said:
This may not help much, but there's a movie about the Loon. Glenn Ford is a sub captain who is involved with the project to launch from subs. He supervises the ramp building, borrows Loons for the Army and eventually, after various setbacks and falling in lust with Viveca Lindfors, the Admiral's secretary.

Anyhow, in the final test loons launched by one sub group fly towards the exercise target carrier group and are passed on to a second group of subs who take control of the Loons and issue final course corrections. That's more capability than I knew the thing had.

The movie is 'The Flying Missile', 1950. It's been on a classic TV channel here lately.

Thanks. Saw it many years ago. Although the plot was rubbish, the cast were top-notch and as you rightly point out the inserted missile footage was brilliant. However, there's another brilliant, but little-known B&W dramatised movie on V-weapons, specifically the V-2 made in East Germany. Well worth a look: Die gefrorenen Blitze – Wikipedia
... available free on YouTube, all in Russian - no English sub-titles but the footage is all self-explanatory and well shot.

Jimbob · Dec 23, 2020

Another from the US manual on German Ordnance.

xylstra · Dec 25, 2020

Jimbob said:
Another from the US manual on German Ordnance.

That's fantastic but what was even more interesting was the lead-in that made references to German proximity fuses. Good stuff!

"Why is there a Bucket on your nose Mr. DOODLEBUG??"

More options

Blixie

Airman

Attachments

GrauGeist

Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung

xylstra

Airman 1st Class

Jimbob

Airman 1st Class

Attachments

GrauGeist

Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung

xylstra

Airman 1st Class

Koopernic

Banned

K5083

Airman 1st Class

Blixie

Airman

xylstra

Airman 1st Class

Jimbob

Airman 1st Class

Attachments

xylstra

Airman 1st Class

Users who are viewing this thread

Similar threads