A-20

[David E Driscoll jr]

I am a big fan of the A-20. I understand that it had a higher speed and distance than the B-25 and required a shorter take off distance and required a smaller crew. I wonder if it might have been a better choice to use for the Doolitle raid than the B-25. Since we just lost the last of the Raiders last October, perhaps it might be a good thread to start. I am a new member on this forum so please don't be too harsh on me.

O a sperate thought, the P-39 suffered from lots of add ons by the Army, thus adding on weight. Then they banned the use of turbocharging because there was such a great demand for them on B-29s and other aircraft of the times!

 

[SaparotRob]

Hi and welcome.

 

[Dash119]

Welcome aboard.

 

[Shortround6]

I am a big fan of the A-20. I understand that it had a higher speed and distance than the B-25 and required a shorter take off distance and required a smaller crew. I wonder if it might have been a better choice to use for the Doolitle raid than the B-25. Since we just lost the last of the Raiders last October, perhaps it might be a good thread to start. I am a new member on this forum so please don't be too harsh on me.

O a sperate thought, the P-39 suffered from lots of add ons by the Army, thus adding on weight. Then they banned the use of turbocharging because there was such a great demand for them on B-29s and other aircraft of the times!

While the A-20 had more speed than the B-25 it had less range, later versions got more fuel but still not enough.
Important part was take-off distance.

Plenty of threads on the P-39. P-39 lost the turbo because the plane was too small to fit the turbo and the needed intercooler and radiators/oil cooler. The turbo was dropped in 1939, well before the B-29 was more than sketches on paper.

 

[glennasher]

^^^^^^^^^ What he said.
As it was, the Doolittle Raiders had to take off too early, and didn't have enough fuel to get to the proposed airfields in China. If they'd used A-20s (if they could have gotten airborne off the Hornet), they'd have never even made the China coast, and all would have been lost in the sea.
Let's not try to re-write history now, that just doesn't work.
I have nothing against the A-20, but I'm sure Doolittle, who had all the Air Corps resources available just for the asking (it was a Presidential imperative, after all) thought thru all these things and made the best choice he could for doing this job. He was one of the very first aeronautical engineers in the whole, wide world, maybe the first one, period. He knew what he was doing.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

Good lord, someone's summoning the Tommyknockers.

 

[Clayton Magnet]

O a sperate thought, the P-39 suffered from lots of add ons by the Army, thus adding on weight. Then they banned the use of turbocharging because there was such a great demand for them on B-29s and other aircraft of the times!

Groundhog Thread Part Deux - P-39 Fantasy and Fetish - The Never Ending Story (Mods take no responsibility for head against wall injuries sustained)

Hello! I was intrigued by reading of this interview with Golodnikov, especially by his mention about true performances of German fighters (color plus some correction of the text by me): "A. S. Nikolay Gerasimovich, if you look at any reference book, the superiority in speed of German aircraft...

ww2aircraft.net

Review that thread, we are quite fortunate to have our own expert that answers every question regarding the P-39!

 

[Snautzer01]

And down into the abyss he goes.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

And down into the abyss he goes.

It isn't a rabbit-hole. It isn't an abyss.

It's a freakin' wormhole through the time-space continuum, full of recursive moments, deja vu all over again, and pareidolia, featuring Captain Ahab as your tour guide.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Review that thread, we are quite fortunate to have our own expert that answers every question regarding the P-39!

And don't forget - he's not a pilot but read the manual!

 

[Snautzer01]

And don't forget - he's not a pilot but read the manual!

But only the pages he liked.

 

[David E Driscoll jr]

^^^^^^^^^ What he said.
As it was, the Doolittle Raiders had to take off too early, and didn't have enough fuel to get to the proposed airfields in China. If they'd used A-20s (if they could have gotten airborne off the Hornet), they'd have never even made the China coast, and all would have been lost in the sea.
Let's not try to re-write history now, that just doesn't work.
I have nothing against the A-20, but I'm sure Doolittle, who had all the Air Corps resources available just for the asking (it was a Presidential imperative, after all) thought thru all these things and made the best choice he could for doing this job. He was one of the very first aeronautical engineers in the whole, wide world, maybe the first one, period. He knew what he was doing.

not critizing DOOLITLE, just curious as to why taking so many crew members when not as many seemed to be needed. thanks for the info and the interest.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

not critizing DOOLITLE, just curious as to why taking so many crew members when not as many seemed to be needed. thanks for the info and the interest.

Co-pilot, navigator and even a radio operator takes a lot of the workload off the pilot.

 

[Grandson312]

The B-25's had to be retro-fitted with several more fuel tanks, sacrificing the lower gun turret, almost doubling it's fuel capacity, as well as other modifications.

The A-20 may simply have not had the size to be able to double its fuel tanks, and even that may not have been enough.
It appears that many of them in the South Pacific already had the lower .50 cal machine gun removed, so there was no weight to be cut there.
It also could not carry nearly as much bomb payload.

The people planning the mission had a better grasp of this than we possibly can.

I like the A-20 also, but it wasn't the plane for the job. The B-25's, even with all the modifications were barely adequate (Doolittle's plane nearly hit the water on takeoff) and I think we're lucky we didn't lose a lot of men on that raid.

There are some photos of rocket-assisted A-20 takeoffs, so at some point they might have been thinking about Carrier use? But it didn't shake out, for whatever reasons.

 

[Greg Boeser]

If you are a fan of the A-20, I highly recommend Rampage of the Roaring 20s, and the recently released Harvest of the Grim Reapers, from International Historical Research Associates. Both titles cover A-20 action in the Southwest Pacific.

 

[Grandson312]

If you are a fan of the A-20, I highly recommend Rampage of the Roaring 20s, and the recently released Harvest of the Grim Reapers, from International Historical Research Associates. Both titles cover A-20 action in the Southwest Pacific.

Thank you, I am reading "Rampage" right now, but did not know about the second title. I'm also waiting on a copy of "Wreaking Havoc" which is written by one of the pilots, Joseph W. Rutter.

I don't know what my Grandfather thought of the A-20 after the war. Like many men of that era, he didn't talk about it. He probably both loved and hated the plane. So I have to temper my natural curiosity of what happened, with what I can ascertain of his wishes.