Air Gunner Aces

[Njaco]

Understood Syd. I posted the RK winners as they must have got a few kills among them. Haven't found any totals yet.

 

[bowfin]

S/SGT John A. Murphy-6- 500 BS 345 BG 5 AF- USAAF- B-25(Top Turret)(all Zero's)

Five of the six came during a single 40 minute span during one mission. Four more either pancaked or caught a wingtip on the watr's surface and crashed as they tried to avoid his fire and come up underneath the B-25.

When I asked him how he could be certain he was the one who shot down each of those five planes, Jack (John) told me he was the only one left shooting.

This was done on a single engine and the crew chief holding a rag tight like a tourniquet on a leaky fuel line. The crew chief could smell gas, so he had taken an axe to the bulkhead to locate the leak so he could plug it. While he was doing this, a 20mm incendiary shell riccocheted of of one of Murphy's guns (disabling it) passed between his legs and impacts just a few inches above the crew chief's head. Luckily, the shell was a dud and the incendiary composition didn't ignite, although it splattered in the crew chief's face and gave him chemical burns.

 

[Gahd4455]

I would be very surprised if all those Defiant kills actually took place. My guess is that less than 50% is more likely. The gunners and the pilots should have gotten medals for actually going into combat in the Defiant.

hi there...My Grandfather was Albert Lippett ...I can confirm he was awarded the DFM and his pilot Nick Cooke received the DFC ...Was shot down over Dunkirk ..missing in action....sadly killed a couple of days before strategic decision to switch Defiants to night fighters...

 

[drgondog]

How about a Hybrid. S/SGT Charles Spencer was credited with 4 zero's in PTO, went to flight school and returned as a 2nd LT to 355th FG where he was credited with an Me 262 on 3-22-45. Is not recognized as an ace.

 

[jim]

probably all on the Ost front and impossible to confirm

It is confirmed that Erwin Hentschel flew 1490 combat sorties. Would you ,at least , give him that?

 

[FalkeEins]

I don't know if this counts, but there were several gunners on Luftwaffe nightfighters who won the Ritterkreuz.. one prominent Luftwaffe nightfighter ace shot down 9 bombers on one sortie and that his gunner was responsible for 3 of them--'Tino' Becker comes to mind as the ace in question, but I am not certain.

PG

FWIW Karl Johannsen's lengthy account of this sortie is here

Karl Johannsen's account of his most memorable sortie -

 

[Barrett]

As noted here, veracity of bomber gunner claims is even worse than fighter claims by a huge factor.
But
There is some hard intel. Naturally I cannot find it now, but in researching Forgotten Fifteenth I found a 1943-44 document showing demonstrated accuracy of various HB gun positions expressed in mils (group dispersion) at 500 yds or so. The most accurate was the ball turret possibly because that was the first HB position to receive a computing sight. Also, counter-intuitively to I Saw It On The Internet, BTGs had the fewest casualties of all bomber aircrew. Heaviest losses were bomb/navs, who of course were right up front.

 

[Greg Boeser]

As noted here, veracity of bomber gunner claims is even worse than fighter claims by a huge factor.
But
There is some hard intel. Naturally I cannot find it now, but in researching Forgotten Fifteenth I found a 1943-44 document showing demonstrated accuracy of various HB gun positions expressed in mils (group dispersion) at 500 yds or so. The most accurate was the ball turret possibly because that was the first HB position to receive a computing sight. Also, counter-intuitively to I Saw It On The Internet, BTGs had the fewest casualties of all bomber aircrew. Heaviest losses were bomb/navs, who of course were right up front.

The problem with being a bombardier was the armored bulkhead was behind you.

 

[Greg Boeser]

S/SGT John D. Foley-7+8 prob- 22ND BG 5 AF- USAAF-B-26(Top Turret)

Of "Johnny got a Zero" fame. 22nd BG gunners claimed 94 kills between April 1942 and January 1943 while equipped with B-26s, losing only 6 bombers to fighters. Tainan Kokutai records do not support more than one or two, and one was a collision. But the Japanese did comment on the difficulty in catching those speedy early Marauders.

 

[Barrett]

Late to the party. Here's obviously a partial list of Commonwealth bomber gunners.

Jan J. Safarik: Air Aces Home Page

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Detailed video bio of Tom McLean, 102 & 617 Sans with 7 originally credited, upgraded to 9.