FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
Hmmm. Can you provide some valid sources for that statement?!?!?
B-32 - Clearing the record a bit
- Thread starter Niceoldguy58
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swampyankee
Chief Master Sergeant
- 3,962
- Jun 25, 2013
While there were certainly anglophobes of various sorts, US-UK relations were not fraught, and hadn't been since before the Trent Affair during the Civil War; had that involved a ship of many other nations, say Prussia, it could have resulted in war. Do remember that the land border between the US and Canada was demilitarized long before Canada was, in any legal sense, independent.
If the old money of the UK and the new money of the USA had continued marrying each other the two could have ended up as a single entity, Churchill himself was the product of such a union, and lets not even mention Mrs Simpson
causing the abdication of the king. Just joking really, but what were the equivalent of todays billionaires need economic and political stability to consider such a relationship.Kevin J
Banned
Try searching 'YOUTUBE' for 'War Plan Red'. I think perhaps the best description of our relationship would be that we were competitors. Post war the UK built 3 different V bombers each with its own special attributes. The Vulcan was almost stealth it appeared as a flock of birds on a radar screen and it had the range to hit most industrial sites in the USSR from our bases in the UK and Cyprus. The Victor had ultra long range and from Goose Bay in Canada could hit everywhere in the continental US. The Valiant had STOL capability so ideal for operation in SE Asia.
Kevin J
Banned
Try searching 'YOUTUBE' for 'War Plan Red'. I think perhaps the best description of our relationship would be that we were competitors. Post war the UK built 3 different V bombers each with its own special attributes. The Vulcan was almost stealth it appeared as a flock of birds on a radar screen and it had the range to hit most industrial sites in the USSR from our bases in the UK and Cyprus. The Victor had ultra long range and from Goose Bay in Canada could hit everywhere in the continental US. The Valiant had STOL capability so ideal for operation in SE Asia.
Kevin J
Banned
Try searching 'YOUTUBE' for 'War Plan Red'. I think perhaps the best description of our relationship would be that we were competitors. Post war the UK built 3 different V bombers each with its own special attributes. The Vulcan was almost stealth it appeared as a flock of birds on a radar screen and it had the range to hit most industrial sites in the USSR from our bases in the UK and Cyprus. The Victor had ultra long range and from Goose Bay in Canada could hit everywhere in the continental US. The Valiant had STOL capability so ideal for operation in SE Asia.
You could also hypothesise about Victors and Vulcans reaching anywhere in Scotland from bases in England, it doesn't mean that nuclear war between England and Scotland was ever considered or a possibility.
swampyankee
Chief Master Sergeant
- 3,962
- Jun 25, 2013
I'm aware of the various colored war plans; I'm also aware that interests change constantly. However, the US and UK had been able to talk everything through for many years. One can speculate why this was true, but I suspect it's because both countries were run more by merchants and lawyers than princes and generals: profit, loss, and debate, not privilege, chivalry, and dictat.
Kevin J
Banned
Everyone seems to forget that post-war we developed nuclear weapons and the means to deliver them, not because the USSR had them but because the Americans had them.
Kevin J
Banned
Remember War Plan Red? Yes, we shared common interests, but the Americans gave us Lease-Lend when our cash ran out because like if your neighbours house was burning down you lent him all you could do help him, even helped him yourself as far as you could. We had to pay for what we used and it took us sixty years to pay it all off. Part of the price was American access to our Empire's markets. We weren't allies until December 1941. Neither were the Irish our allies, but they granted us the Irish Air Corridor, look it up, and they really were neutral. It didn't stop some of their boys coming across the Irish Sea to help us though because they figured if the Germans got through us then they'd be next.
Who is "we" the Manhattan project was a collaboration, some of the early work was done in what is now my local community centre in N England. The UK developed its own nuclear weapon to be independent. It is impossible to guarantee that the USA would intervene in a conflict with Russia. The French did the same.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
You have a very distorted view of history. War Plan was just that, "A PLAN," a scenario that "could have" happened. Despite what you think or say, the US/ UK relationship was far from what you describe.
This is starting to get political and very off subject so please remain on topic. THE B-32
Shortround6
Major General
I would note that a "war plan" is, as FlyboyJ says, a "plan" and is often done to evaluate future needs and procurement over a number of years.
The Subject of such a plan is often the strongest possible opponent rather than a probable opponent. In part because if you plan for the strongest opponent then you should be in good shape for any lesser opponent and have a reserve for 'surprises'. Like last minute alliances. Britain Pre WW I usually tried to plan to take on the next two biggest navies in the world regardless of how well things may have been going diplomatically in any given year.
The Subject of such a plan is often the strongest possible opponent rather than a probable opponent. In part because if you plan for the strongest opponent then you should be in good shape for any lesser opponent and have a reserve for 'surprises'. Like last minute alliances. Britain Pre WW I usually tried to plan to take on the next two biggest navies in the world regardless of how well things may have been going diplomatically in any given year.
I would think another aspect is that a plan by the USA for conflict with the UK would be the only one they could actually "war game" to evaluate how much a "plan" works in reality.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
Gentlemen, A reminder....
MIflyer
1st Lieutenant
A friend of mine was trained as a gunner late in WWII, firing at RP-63's in training. He was told that for the invasion of Japan they would be in B-32's acting as gunships, flying low with the gunners firing at ground targets. Of course the atomic attacks eliminated that mission and he went on to become a radar intercept controller in Germany after the war.
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
A good shot of the nose of a B-32 with it's Sperry turret.
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vikingBerserker
Lieutenant General
I always thought it was a good looking aircraft.
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
Me too...except for the signature Convair tail!
I remember reading that one could tell the B-24 pilots by their overdeveloped left arms 
Did the B-32 have any flight quirks like that?
I also wonder if going with a Constellation or 314 style triple tail might have solved the stability issues better than that ginormous single tail.
Did the B-32 have any flight quirks like that? I also wonder if going with a Constellation or 314 style triple tail might have solved the stability issues better than that ginormous single tail.
