B.V. 141

[bobbysocks]

I found a bunch of old circulars in news print from 1943. they are all dedicated to flight and had sections on the war, flight theory, what's new in avaition, etc.. in the one it had a small blurp showing a bizarre nazi ac claiming it was being used over russia. from what i see it never entered service. anyone have any other info on it. it is curious that a newsletter type publication would have info on something this obscure though. maybe i will scan the publication and post it in the next few days.




View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGL_tqwjA_Q


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SV96hXwWN7c

 

[T Bolt]

There is some info on it here on wikipedia
Blohm Voss BV 141 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Njaco]

It was an asymetrical design that actually workd for recon. Here are some pics from Bundesarchiv.

 

[bobbysocks]

wow! those are some great pics!

 

[davebender]

Perhaps so but I don't see any asymetrical aircraft in service today. That leads me to believe asymetrical designs are a bad idea.

 

[Njaco]

No argument there.

Nothing wrong with the plane but pilots had a hard time because their natural perception was off set.

 

[Milosh]

Perhaps so but I don't see any asymetrical aircraft in service today. That leads me to believe asymetrical designs are a bad idea.

Scaled Composites Model 202 Boomerang

 

[Njaco]

I guess left turns are a breeze.

 

[bobbysocks]

the real B!t<# would be if you suffered engine failure. the asymetrical design compensated for engine torque. if that torque suddenly dissappeared then what? maybe i am wrong but that would make for a very exciting forced landing...

 

[evangilder]

There were a number of asymmetrical designs by the Germans that were used in WWII. Despite their odd appearance, they flew well.

 

[bobbysocks]

that's what i have been reading...it was actually a good performer.

"Lucky for us, because the first test flight on 25 February 1938 showed that the aerodynamic qualities of the design were unequalled. One of the main problems with a single engine plane is the motor torque, which was canceled out by the asymmetrism. Cockpit view must have been great as well.
The plane was 1215cm long with a wingspan of 1728cm. Powered by a BMW132 radial engine of 625hp, it had a top speed of 446km/hr, a ceiling of 9000m, and a range of 1260km. This range was almost twice that of the Fw-189 which the Nazis had preferred."

and that it was actually used in poland. not only did it recon but it also bombed.

 

[Ivan1GFP]

Hi Bobbysocks,

I built one of these planes for Combat Flight Simulator a few years back. The asymmetrical design compensated well for engine torque as you stated. There were actually two versions of the plane. The easily distinguished feature is the tailplane. In the first model, it was nearly symmetrical. In the later version, the tailplane was mostly on the engine side. You quoted specs for the first version. The later version (BV 141B-0) was a much more powerful aircraft and served mostly on the Russian front.

It served as a light bomber and reconaissance aircraft (Aufklarer) and apparenly functioned very well. There were only about 20 aircraft built in all. The big problem with the plane was that it competed for resources with aircraft that were deemed to be more important (it used a BMW 801 engine) and less unorthodox aircraft such as the FW 189 (a twin engine design) functioned as well for the purpose. The advantage of the offset engine was that the view all around was fairly good and the gunners had very good arcs of fire.

Doktor Richard Vogt, the designer seemed to a bit obsessed with asymmetrical aircraft and designed quite a few, but none seemed to have any real advantages over more conventional designs. In my opinion, the BV 141B-0 was probably the best of the asymmetrics.

My CFS plane can be found on this page:
http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforu...=downloads&page=downloads&FileUploadName=Ivan

I'll post some screenshots if anyone is interested.
- Ivan.

 

[davebender]

Everything I have read suggests the Fw-189 was one of the finest short range reconnaissance aircraft produced during WWII. Perhaps the BV-141 would have fared better if the competition had not been so good.

 

[Njaco]

Everything I have read suggests the Fw-189 was one of the finest short range reconnaissance aircraft produced during WWII. Perhaps the BV-141 would have fared better if the competition had not been so good.

Makes you scratch your head when the Bv141 had a good longer range. Of course everything went out the window with the Ar234 for recon.

 

[davebender]

The RLM specifications were for a short range recon aircraft to support the Heer. I suspect that endurance, low cost, low stall speed and ability to operate from primative airfields were considered more important then long range.

The Vietnam era OV-10 had a similiar mission. Let's do a comparison just for the heck of it.

Fw-189. Introduced during 1941.
416 mile range.
?? hour loiter.
3 crew.
3,950kg loaded weight.
2 x 460hp As-410 air cooled V12 engines.
Newer models had 2 x 592hp As-411 engines. Essentially an improved As-410.

OV-10A. Introduced during 1969
576 mile range.
3 hour loiter.
2 crew.
4,494kg loaded weight.
2 x 715hp turboprop engines.

 

[Westfield Charlie]

Great information fellas. I just ordered a Hobby Boss 1/48 scale model and wanted to see what you said about the bird.

 

[Capt. Vick]

The first 2 pictures on the 3rd post are of a Fw 189.

 

[Ivan1GFP]

The BV 141B was actually a very good performer for the type.
It's main fault was that its hydraulics were weak and unreliable but that could have been corrected while in service.
The biggest issue was that it used the BMW 801 engine and those were in great demand for other aircraft.
The FW 189 did not have the same performance, but used Argus engines which were not in such demand.
While the BV 141B performed better, the FW 189 performed well enough.

- Ivan.

 

[Denniss]

+ the 189 had two engines and may limp back home with one of them disabled

 

[Ivan1GFP]

+ the 189 had two engines and may limp back home with one of them disabled

Hello Denniss,
Perhaps the FW 189 has a better chance of limping home with one engine out, but it also is more likely to get intercepted and shot down because of its much lower performance. You ought to read Eric Brown's evaluation of the BV 141B. It wasn't that bad considering that for mechanical reasons, his flight was the last time that aeroplane was ever to fly.
There are a few videos of the BV 141B in flight. You should watch them to get a feel for what this aeroplane really could do. Now keep in mind there is a pretty great difference in performance between the B model and earlier versions. Just look for the asymmetrical tail.

Much as I like the aeroplane, I believe the Germans made the correct decision in picking FW 189. That much performance in a Recon aeroplane / light bomber just isn't necessary.... But it IS cool!

- Ivan.