BF109 G-10 'Red 2' JG300 Marking questions?

Discussion in 'Aircraft Markings and Camouflage' started by Alte Hase, Oct 9, 2011.

  1. Alte Hase

    Alte Hase Member

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    Hi all,

    I'm STILL researching this aircraft , and noticed from the three existing photos I've seen of it (on Jagdgeschwader 300 "Wilden Sau" | Home | wichtige Worte) that it carries a small yellow circle stencilled just behind the canopy on the fuselage side. I know of an exact same marking existing on FW190A-8 R2s, which indicated a ore powerful engine was installed,but what does this marking mean on a 109G-10?

    Also, does anybody know if this aircraft carried the small red cross stencil on/next to the first aid kit compartment?

    Thanks again!
     
  2. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    Do you mean the plane? The profile source... Osprey - Aircraft of the Aces 068 - Bf109 Defence Of The Reich Aces.
     

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  3. Ratsel

    Ratsel Banned

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    #3 Ratsel, Oct 9, 2011
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2011
    First off, this machine is not a G-10, its a very rare Erla built Bf-109G-14/AS. In the fotos I've seen the first aid symbol does not appear to be there. No idea about the yellow circle... Hope this helps.

    rita.jpg

    rita2.jpg

    some pilots did practice circleling small bullit holes with the date rather then patching it.. perhaps this is the case?
     
  4. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    Another one profile..... this time it's mentioned as Bf109G-14/AS...

    [​IMG]
     
  5. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    And the next one...

    [​IMG]
     
  6. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
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    go to Military Aviation Art World War 2 Books For Sale

    and order the the two volume set of JG 300 and your question(s) will be asked on ALL your modeling needs for JG 300 ................... there is more research on the books pages than anything on the net............seriously anyone who owns these volumes agrees with me. the only thing lacking is more on the anti-Moskito staffel 10.(N)/JG 300 which I have for my book to come .......

    Gruß
     
  7. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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  8. Ratsel

    Ratsel Banned

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    The higher oil fill position of the 50l oil tank lack of chin bulges just means this machine is equipt with the DB 605ASCM w/ the deeper Fo 987 oil cooler. Nice pic btw!
     
  9. stona

    stona Well-Known Member

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    #9 stona, Oct 9, 2011
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2011
    I take it that the Werk Nummer 490642 is spurious then. That's not in a G-14 block.Erla built very few G-14/AS in the blocks 460322-460371 and 460645-461378.
    If it is correct then it is an Erla built G-10/AS from the 490000-491600 block. The camouflage looks like Erla.
    Just my two bob's worth.
    Cheers
    Steve
     
  10. Ratsel

    Ratsel Banned

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    Yep, W.Nr.490 642 would not be the correct serial. Franky, there was no official designation of G-10/AS by either Mtt-Reg, Erla, or WNF. There were many sub-contractors of Erla, etc., that put these machines together, so paint schemes, although useful, are not a 100% garrenty of where a plane was manufactured. ;)
     
  11. Alte Hase

    Alte Hase Member

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    Thanks guys for all the info. Yes, I've ordered the JG300 history!

    On the topic of the profiles: I have the Osprey Aircraft Of The Aces BF109 Defence of the Reich Aces book.The Osprey profile is incorrect-Having seen the three photos of Red2, there are a number of inaccuracies in the profile. The second one (of Red2 as G-14AS) is much more accurate.

    I read in the Osprey Elite Units No.020 Sturmgruppen that the luftwaffe put a small yellow circle on the cowling of their FW190A-8/R2s that had the more powerful BMW801 (D-2?) engines, to show ground crews that they were non-standard engines. I was wondering if possibly the Bf109G-10/G-14AS Red 2 could also have had the yellow circle to signify that it too had a non-standard engine? Perhaps this is yet more evidence that this rather widely debated aircraft was NOT a standard G-10/G-14AS? Does anybody know if these small yellow circles appear on any other Bf109s? I strongly doubt it is a circled bullet hole.
     
  12. Alte Hase

    Alte Hase Member

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    Thanks guys for all the info. Yes, I've ordered the JG300 history!

    On the topic of the profiles: I have the Osprey Aircraft Of The Aces BF109 Defence of the Reich Aces book.The Osprey profile is incorrect-Having seen the three photos of Red2, there are a number of inaccuracies in the profile. The second one (of Red2 as G-14AS) is much more accurate.

    I read in the Osprey Elite Units No.020 Sturmgruppen that the luftwaffe put a small yellow circle on the cowling of their FW190A-8/R2s that had the more powerful BMW801 (D-2?) engines, to show ground crews that they were non-standard engines. I was wondering if possibly the Bf109G-10/G-14AS Red 2 could also have had the yellow circle to signify that it too had a non-standard engine? Perhaps this is yet more evidence that this rather widely debated aircraft was NOT a standard G-10/G-14AS? Does anybody know if these small yellow circles appear on any other Bf109s? I strongly doubt it is a circled bullet hole.
     
  13. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
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    hope you mentioned my name to Jerry/Judy when you ordered the books .......... ? , no matter. there is no werke nummer listed for Röte 2. it is a G-14/AS like the rest of the other staffel mounts, not a G-10 or sub-type; shown at least 1-2 others in the second volume of JG 300 book. as to ospreys attempt on the Sturmgruppen that book should be thrown in the trash or left as a good door stop the text and captioning are atrocious and the materials for the profiles really can not be taken seriously........... my opinion of course.
     
  14. Crimea_River

    Crimea_River Well-Known Member

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    Did Claes Sundin get the tail wheel wrong?
     
  15. Alte Hase

    Alte Hase Member

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    I definitely think Red2 had the short tail wheel. As a G-14 it would be consistent, but also looking at the angle she sits at in the photos on previous posts, it looks like she had the short tail wheel...
     
  16. Ratsel

    Ratsel Banned

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    I havn't seen any -109's that show anything special about the engine by way of painted warning. The only indication would be either 87/C3 fuel warning label. Nothing special about red 2 engine other then its the DB 605ASCM w/ the deeper Fo 987 oil cooler.

    phoca_thumb_l_fotografia%20045.jpg

    On the engine itself though.... Thats a different matter :D
     
  17. Denniss

    Denniss Active Member

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    But this image is of a special engine using a non-standard ignition sequence. That's what the huge red marking says.
    The markings on the Fw 190 are for special boost systems - AFAIR it was for "erhöhte Notleistung" low-alt C-3 injection.
     
  18. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
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    as I stated the craft is a G-14/AS, nothing special about it, it does not have a yellow under engine cowling and no werk nummer present.
     
  19. Ratsel

    Ratsel Banned

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    pretty much. IMO the correct colours would be RLM 74/75/76. Seems RLM82/83 were for the most part used on the 'K' series.

    "Did Claes Sundin get the tail wheel wrong?"
    meh, nobodies perfect.
     
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