Catch22
Major
Thanks Geo, but it's quite old. I wonder what they saw then.
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Thanks Geo, but it's quite old. I wonder what they saw then.
But surely better airframes make for better aircraft?
Su-35 has 2d thrust vectoring nozzles, the F-35 doesn't.
It all comes down to the stealth profile. Do you think that stealth won't be defeated in the life of the F-35? Or even by the time it enters service for Australia (around 2018-202)? Or even now?
With 2 medium range missiles on board the F-35 will soon be in a knife fight if there are more than 2 enemy aircraft and/or the missiles aren't 100% accurate.
I was kinda thinking about the outmanoeuvring part. Does that still apply to the Sidewinder?
If it isn't needed, why does it have one?
Compared to the F-111s that the F-35s are also replacing (albeit indirectly. As an interim replacement we got F-18Fs, which also require more tankers than previously).
Still, less effective than internal carriage for the F-35, meaning more likely being detected and shot down.
The F-35 is not ment to be a dog fighter. Never has. It is to work side by side with the F-22. F-22 does all the air to air. F-35 is ment to get in, drop pay load, and get out. Air to air missles are for self-defence if things get hairy. But if it needs to, the F-35 can dog fight....
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSMNOaZVFaA Best video that I know to kinda describe the mission of the F-35.....
What if you don't have F-22s? Like, say, Australia?
Firstly, it's hard to imagine a scenario where a single F-35 would engage in one-on-one combat - CAPS always have at least 2 airframes to ensure you always have one aircraft pointing "up threat". Secondly, stealth isn't that important for air defence operations so you can hang more missiles off the pylons. I still reckon the sensors onboard the F-35 give it an advantage over most other combat aircraft out there today.
And everything I've seen about the thrust vectoring nozzles is that they're great for airshows or a one-off snapshot but in combat, where energy is a key asset, they are of limited, if any, utility.
I dunno but I do know that "defeat" is a very loaded phrase. Stealth isn't an invisibility cloak but it does help you avoid being detected. If that gives you even just a couple of seconds advantage, that's all you need to kill the other guy first.
Because guns are used for more things than just air combat. They can also strafe targets on the ground. Multi-role, remember?
But the F-111 is out of service. The F-35 has a longer combat radius than the F/A-18 so it's less dependent on tankers than the RAAF's current inventory.
Will be carefull of what I do post.....
That's something your military procurement planners need to answer. Personally I don't think Australia will have issues with the aircraft in either role providing she can afford them, that where my original comment was made about the F-16. I know the 16 was considered years ago but with hindsight being 20/20, I think it was the better aircraft especially if costs are a major factor.What if you don't have F-22s? Like, say, Australia?
Totally understand! I may be out there at the end of April/ beginning of May. maybe we could finally meet for a beer!
Personally I don't think Australia will have issues with the aircraft in either role
How will the defence budget cuts impact F-35 now? Is Obama in favour of this project?
It looks bad for nearly anything.
Ivan
Well lets say the enemy can detect you at longer ranges than your missiles can reach, and their missiles can reach that far? Would that count as defeat?
I think by the time the full rate production planes come along, the planes will be below 100 million, where they are advertised to be.....
That's the nub of the problem, although it's not just detection range and missile range but also missile acceleration and speed - all of this is highly dependent on the engagement parameters as well as the specific performance characteristics of the airframe, systems and weapons. Unfortunately, it's a question we're unlikely to resolve on this forum because the specific RCS for the F-35 under different loads are, I suspect, highly classified.