Hitler's Germany invades Poland... September 1, 1939

sorry chris, I did think i was doing that, but will try a different approach in the next posts

stona said:

Rubbish. Britain needed war like a hole in the head. You don't need a war to justify rearmament in a democratic state.The mere threat of war,an entirely different thing,suffices.

The idea that anyone but the usual lunatic fringe in Britain or France wanted a war with Germany is ridiculous. The Great War was still well within living memory and many of those countries leaders had fought in it. You could more reasonably argue that this led to a desperate urge to avoid war,almost at any cost. The appeasement policies of the 1930s simply reflect this.

Steve

Click to expand...

You misunderstand me. The Chancellor of the Exchequer told HMG that Rearmament could not continue at the pace it was in the late 1930s, without emergency powers to pay for further the buildup. Otherwise they would have to cut back , just at the wrong time. The German invasion of Poland gave them the justification they needed to start emergency powers.

I wonder if there was a way initiating "emergency powers" short of declaring war?

One of the enduring myths of the Polish campaign was that the PAF was removed from the battle within the first 48 hours or so of the campaign. In fact, despite being heavily outnumbered, and flying largely obsolete aircraft, the PAF continued to fight very effectively for an extended period. It was evacuated to Rumania in the finish, where unformatunately for the Poles their equiipment was impounded and then expropriated by the Rumanians.

During the fighting in Poland, the Luftwaffe took a bit of a hit, losing about 500 aircraft to all causes. The plucky Polish Fighter groups perhaps best exemplified the Polish fighting spirit. There were about 110 P-11s at the start, and to that were added about 30 p-7s, and about 20 or so various other types during the campaign. The P-11s are credited with shooting down about 120 German a/c during the campaign, whilst losing about 60 or so to all causes. From memory, about 40 escaped to Rumania, the remainder were unserviceable and reportedly were burnt to avoid capture.

It was not just aircrew that escaped to fight another day. Several large warships, including a submarine and a destroyer (perhaps more), and entire Army Corps, the enigma secret (just prior to the outbreak of war....perhaps the greates asset to escape the collapse of the country), all escaped, and wrote many glorious pages in the following ars events. In my opinion, there were none who fought so valiantly and forlornly as the Poles, who faced such hardships and setbacks during the war. We should not in particular forget the efforts of the Home Army and the uprisings in the warsaw Ghetto, I believe it was from that suffering that such a concerted push to establish the state of Israel after the war emerged.

As a small aside, there were uncomon concentrations of jews in Poles stretching back to the middle ages. since that time, Poland had shown remarkable tolerance toward the Jews whilst other nations had shown a large amount of racism. For that reason, over the period of several centuries, Jews had tended to concentrate in Poland....

".... In my opinion, there were none who fought so valiantly and forlornly as the Poles, "

Agreed. And again and again, they found themselves on the fuzzy end of the stick .... Falaise, Market Garden ... to name 2 .....

MM

They fought at Cassino and for the russians (less their officers) on the Eastern Front. A Polish manned cruiser of the RN was scuttled to help form the breakwater of the artifical harbour at Normandy

A total of 249000 Poles fought in the Army with manpower derived from the following sources
Deserters from the German Wehrmacht 89,300
Evacuees from the USSR in 1941 83,000
Evacuees from France in 1940 35,000
Liberated POWs 21,750
Escapees from occupied Europe 14,210
Recruits in liberated France 7,000
Polonia from Argentina, Brazil and Canada 2,290
Polonia from the United Kingdom 1,780

Until July 1945, when recruitment was halted, some 26,830 Polish soldiers were declared KIA or MIA or had died of wounds. After that date, an additional 21,000 former Polish POWs were inducted.

After the country's defeat in the 1939 campaign, the Polish government in exile quickly organized in France a new army of about 80,000 men. In 1940 a Polish Highland Brigade took part in the Battle of Narvik (Norway), and two Polish divisions (First Grenadier Division, and Second Infantry Fusiliers Division) took part in the defense of France, while a Polish motorized brigade and two infantry divisions were in process of forming. A Polish Independent Carpathian Brigade was formed in French-mandated Syria, to which many Polish troops had escaped from Romania. The Polish Air Force in France comprised eighty-six aircraft in four squadrons, one and a half of the squadrons being fully operational while the rest were in various stages of training.

After the fall of France, numbers of Polish personnel had died in the fighting (some 6,000) or been interned in Switzerland (some 13,000). Nevertheless, General Władysław Sikorski, Polish commander-in-chief and prime minister, was able to evacuate many Polish troops to the United Kingdom. In 1941, following an agreement between the Polish government in exile and Joseph Stalin, the Soviets released Polish citizens, from whom a 75,000-strong army was formed in the USSR under General Władysław Anders. Without any support from the Soviets to train, equip and maintain this army, the Polish government in exile followed Anders' advice for a transfer of some 80,000 (and around 20,000 civilians), in March and August 1942, across the Caspian Sea to Iran. In the Middle East, this "Anders' Army" joined the British 8th army, where it became the Polish II Corps.

The Polish Air Force first fought in 1939 against the german aggression into Poland (Case White). Outnumbered and with its fighters outmatched by more advanced German fighters, as mentioned previously, the PAF inflicted significant damage out of proportion to its numbers on the Luftwaffe. The Luftwaffe lost, to all operational causes, 585 aircraft, while the Poles lost 333 aircraft.

After the fall of Poland many Polish pilots escaped via Hungary to France. The Polish Air Force fought in the Battle of France as one fighter squadron GC 1/145, several small units detached to French squadrons, and numerous flights of industry defence (in total, 133 pilots, who achieved 53-57 victories at a loss of 8 men in combat, what was 7,93% of allied victories).

Later, Polish pilots fought in the Battle of Britain, where the Polish 303 Fighter Squadron claimed the highest number of kills of any Allied squadron. From the very beginning of the war, the Royal Air Force (RAF) had welcomed foreign pilots to supplement the dwindling pool of British pilots. On 11 June 1940, the Polish Government in Exile signed an agreement with the British Government to form a Polish Army and Polish Air Force in the United Kingdom. The first two (of an eventual ten) Polish fighter squadrons went into action in August 1940. Four Polish squadrons eventually took part in the Battle of Britain (300 and 301 Bomber Squadrons; 302 and 303 Fighter Squadrons), with 89 Polish pilots. Together with more than 50 Poles fighting in British squadrons, a total of 145 Polish pilots defended British skies. Polish pilots were among the most experienced in the battle, most of them having already fought in the 1939 September Campaign in Poland and the 1940 Battle of France. Additionally, prewar Poland had set a very high standard of pilot training. The 303 Squadron, named after the Polish-American hero, General Tadeusz Kościuszko (and the highest mountain in Australia), claimed the highest number of kills (126) of all fighter squadrons engaged in the Battle of Britain, even though it only joined the combat on August 30, 1940. These Polish pilots, constituting 5% of the pilots active during the Battle of Britain, were responsible for 12% of total victories in the Battle.

126 German aeroplanes shot down by the 303 squadron during the Battle of Britain. The Polish Air Force also fought in 1943 in Tunisia (Polish Fighting Team, so called "Skalski's Circus") and in raids on Germany (1940–45). In the second half of 1941 and early 1942, Polish bomber squadrons were the sixth part of forces available to RAF Bomber Command (later they suffered heavy losses, with little replenishment possibilities). Polish aircrew losses serving with Bomber Command 1940-45 were 929 killed. Ultimately 8 Polish fighter squadrons were formed within the RAF and had claimed 629 Axis aircraft destroyed by May 1945. By the end of the war, around 19,400 Poles were serving in the RAF.

Polish squadrons in the United Kingdom:
No. 300 "Masovia" Polish Bomber Squadron (Ziemi Mazowieckiej)
No. 301 "Pomerania" Polish Bomber Squadron (Ziemi Pomorskiej)
No. 302 "City of Poznań" Polish Fighter Squadron (Poznański)
No. 303 "Kościuszko" Polish Fighter Squadron (Warszawski imienia Tadeusza Kościuszki)
No. 304 "Silesia" Polish Bomber Squadron (Ziemi Śląskiej imienia Ksiecia Józefa Poniatowskiego)
No. 305 "Greater Poland" Polish Bomber Squadron (Ziemi Wielkopolskiej imienia Marszałka Józefa Piłsudskiego)
No. 306 "City of Toruń" Polish Fighter Squadron (Toruński)
No. 307 "City of Lwów" Polish Fighter Squadron (Lwowskich Puchaczy)
No. 308 "City of Kraków" Polish Fighter Squadron (Krakowski)
No. 309 "Czerwien" Polish Fighter-Reconnaissance Squadron (Ziemi Czerwieńskiej)
No. 315 "City of Dęblin" Polish Fighter Squadron (Dębliński)
No. 316 "City of Warsaw" Polish Fighter Squadron (Warszawski)
No. 317 "City of Wilno" Polish Fighter Squadron (Wileński)
No. 318 "City of Gdansk" Polish Fighter-Reconnaissance Squadron (Gdański)
No. 663 Polish Artillery Observation Squadron
Polish Fighting Team (Skalski's Circus){attached to No. 145 Squadron}
No. 138 Special Duty Squadron Polish Flight "C"
No. 1586 Polish Special Duty Flight

For the navy on the eve of war, three destroyers — representing most of the major Polish Navy ships - had been sent for safety to the British Isles (Operation Peking). There they fought alongside the Royal Navy. At various stages of the war, the Polish Navy comprised two cruisers and a large number of smaller ships. The Polish navy was given a number of British ships and submarines which would otherwise have been unused due to the lack of trained British crews. The Polish Navy fought with great distinction alongside the other Allied navies in many important and successful operations, including those conducted against the German battleship, Bismarck. During the war the Polish Navy, which comprised a total of 27 ships (2 cruisers, 9 destroyers, 5 submarines and 11 torpedo boats), escorted 787 convoys, conducted 1,162 patrols and combat operations, sank 12 enemy ships (including 5 submarines) and 41 merchant vessels, damaged 24 more (including 8 submarines) and shot down 20 aircraft. 450 seamen out of the over 4,000 who served with the Navy lost their lives in action.

Cruisers: Dragon– Dragoon (British Danae class), Conrad (British Danae class)

Destroyers: Wicher– Gale (Wicher class) sunk September 1939, Burza– Storm (Wicher class), Grom– Thunder (Grom class) sunk 1940, Błyskawica– Lightning (Grom class), Garland (British G class) Orkan (British M-class destroyer Myrmidion) sunk 1943, Ouragan, sometimes called Huragan– Hurricane (French Bourrasque class), Piorun– Thunderbolt (British N class),

Escort destroyers: Krakowiak– Cracovian (British Hunt class) 1941–1946, Kujawiak– Kujawian (British Hunt class), Ślązak– Silesian (British Hunt class)

Submarines: Orzeł– Eagle (Orzeł class) lost 1940, Sęp– Vulture (Orzeł class) interned Sweden, Jastrząb– Hawk (British S class), Wilk– Wolf (Wilk class) to reserve 1942, Ryś– Lynx (Wilk class) interned Sweden, Żbik– Wildcat (Wilk class) interned Sweden, Dzik– Boar (British U class) 1942–1946
Sokół– Falcon (British U class) 1941–1945

Heavy minelayers: Gryf– Griffin (Gryf class) sunk 1939

Light minelayers ("ptaszki"– "Birds"): Jaskółka– Swallow, sunk 1939
ORP Mewa– Seagull
ORP Rybitwa– Tern
ORP Czajka– Lapwing
ORP Żuraw– Crane
ORP Czapla– Heron

The Polish River Fleet

A number of minor ships, transports, merchant-marine auxiliary vessels, and patrol boats. Polish Merchant Navy contributed about 137,000 BRT to Allied shipping; losing 18 ships (with capacity of 76,000 BRT) and over 200 sailors during the war

The Polish forces in the East
(from wiki)

"Broadly speaking, there were two formations among the Polish Armed Forces in the East. First was the Polish government-in-exile-loyal Anders Army, created in the second half of 1941 after German invasion of the USSR. In 1943 this formation was transferred to the Western Allies and became known as the Polish II Corps. Additionally, remaining Polish forces in USSR were reorganized into the Soviet-controlled Polish I Corps in the Soviet Union, which in turn was reorganized in 1944 into the Polish First Army (Berling Army) and Polish Second Army, both part of Polish People's Army (Ludowe Wojsko Polskie, LWP). In 1944, following the takeover of Poland by Soviets from Nazi Germany, the Polish People's Army was reorganized into a Poland-based military formation.

In the aftermath of the Operation Barbarossa, Stalin agreed (Sikorski-Mayski Agreement) to release tens of thousands of Polish prisoners-of-war held in Soviet camps from whom a military force was formed. The Anders Army, as the formation became known, was loyal to the Polish government in exile, and as such its formation was obstructed by the Soviets. Eventually, with about 40 000 combatants and 70 000 civilians, it was transferred to the British command in the Middle East, becoming the Polish II Corps and part of the Polish Armed Forces in the West.

To utilize the potential of the remaining Polish soldiers in USSR, without actually allowing them to become independent from Soviet control, a fact which allowed Anders Army to leave USSR, the Soviet Union created a Union of Polish Patriots (ZPP) in 1943 as communist puppet counter-government to the Polish government in exile. At the same time a parallel army (Polish People's Army or LWP) was created which, by the end of the war, numbered about 200,000 soldiers. The Soviet created guerilla force called Armia Ludowa was integrated with the Polish People's Army at the end of the war. These Soviet controlled units on the Eastern Front included the First, the Second and the Third Polish Armies (the latter was later merged with the second), and Air Force of the Polish Army with 10 infantry divisions, 5 armored brigades and 4 divisions of air force.

The Polish First Army was integrated in the 1st Belorussian Front with which it entered Poland from Soviet territory in 1944. Ordered to hold position by the Soviet leadership, it did not advance towards Warsaw as Germans suppressed the Warsaw Uprising. It took part in battles for Bydgoszcz, Kolobrzeg (Kolberg), Gdańsk (Danzig) and Gdynia losing 20,000 people in the winter of 1944-45 battles. In April–May 1945 the 1st Army fought in the final capture of Berlin. The Polish Second Army fought as part of the Soviet 1st Ukrainian Front and took part in the Prague Offensive. In the final operations of the war the losses of the two armies of the LWP amounted to 32,000.