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ricardo said:Maybe it is a type error, as you said... maybe not.
Anyway, the P-38 did a good job on the MTO and the PTO.
FLYBOYJ said:ricardo said:Okay, I'm at home right now, and guess what? I found the info. As a fact, it is not AVIATION... actually it is FLIGHT JOURNAL (august 2003). I go to page #36 at the bottom.
P-38:
Sorties = 129,820
bomb tonnage = 1,771
enemy aircraft destroyed on air = 749
enemy aircraft destroyed on ground = 1,951
combat losses = 1,758
loss rate per sortie = 1.7%
The 1,771 enemy aircraft shot down that you were talking about correspond to bomb tonnage dropped by the P-38s on the ETO.
I believe everything but the air-to-air kills, there should be one in front of that seven based on the previously posted comments from Roger Freeman, author of "The Mighty Eight." I believe its a typo error. I got family coming over tonight, but I am going to find some of my books on this subject as well as internet sources. I've seen those numbers before and it shows the P-38 had slightly more air-to-air kills than losses.
wmaxt said:FLYBOYJ said:ricardo said:Okay, I'm at home right now, and guess what? I found the info. As a fact, it is not AVIATION... actually it is FLIGHT JOURNAL (august 2003). I go to page #36 at the bottom.
P-38:
Sorties = 129,820
bomb tonnage = 1,771
enemy aircraft destroyed on air = 749
enemy aircraft destroyed on ground = 1,951
combat losses = 1,758
loss rate per sortie = 1.7%
The 1,771 enemy aircraft shot down that you were talking about correspond to bomb tonnage dropped by the P-38s on the ETO.
I believe everything but the air-to-air kills, there should be one in front of that seven based on the previously posted comments from Roger Freeman, author of "The Mighty Eight." I believe its a typo error. I got family coming over tonight, but I am going to find some of my books on this subject as well as internet sources. I've seen those numbers before and it shows the P-38 had slightly more air-to-air kills than losses.
This site shows the number of aircraft that did not return to Britain after their combat missions - these are the numbers that generate the 4:1 comes from http://www.taphilo.com/history/8thaf/8aflosses.shtml
In the Med 113 P-38s were lost for 608 kills for a 5.32:1 ratio against the same aircraft.
The bomb tonnage number is also wrong 1 P-38FG alone dropped 660,000lbs and the P-51 number is high the P-51s did minimal ground attack with bombs. P-51s did most of their ground attacks on the return from escorts.
This site has an article on the various sizes of US aircraft and some very good articles on the P-38 in general. http://home.att.net/~C.C.Jordan/index.html
wmaxt
DerAdlerIstGelandet said:Also you have to look at the fact that combat losses does not neccessarily mean it was shot down. The aircraft could have had mechanical problems on a mission and not returned to base. That is still a combat loss.
DerAdlerIstGelandet said:Yeap I did not meantion AA. I bet you quite a bit did not return because of AA.
ric said:One must be right and the other one must be wrong.
the lancaster kicks ass said:ric said:One must be right and the other one must be wrong.
or they could both be wrong, when checking stats it's best to get sources from several different media types to confirm data.......