Is it really worth it?
- Thread starter Lucky13
- Start date
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Science and medicine are a wonderful thing...
More people need to start believing in it.
michael rauls
Tech Sergeant
- 1,679
- Jul 15, 2016
You forgot one step in the process. Cancer( and many other maladies) are triggered not by genetic material lying dormant in the body but by the active expression of that genetic material(RNA/DNA) and most anything you put into your body will change that expression to one degree or another. Some for the good and some for the bad.
With smoking I think it's safe to say it changes said genetic expression in a negative way. That is why certain types of cancer are almost unique to smokers.
Hope this helps.
special ed
1st Sergeant
- 4,901
- May 13, 2018
Two quick points if I may. My first wife smoked since she was twelve. Her last years were on oxygen carrying around the bag with tubes to her nose. Point two, It is just as they say.
For a nonsmoker to kiss a smoker, it's like licking an ash tray.
For a nonsmoker to kiss a smoker, it's like licking an ash tray.
The negative health aspects of smoking are not just limited to cancer...
Emphysema
COPD
Asthma
Just to name a few.
Peter Gunn
Master Sergeant
I'll add my condolences on the passing of your friend Jan, sorry to hear that.
I quit smoking (unfiltered Camels) in 1984, fiance, now wife, said if I smoked she wouldn't kiss me...
Must have been the right decision, four kids and 34th Anniversary coming up in September.
And Chris is right, you don't know how bad you smell until you quit and then run into someone that does smoke. For the life of me, I can't imagine why anyone would pick up the habit anymore.
I quit smoking (unfiltered Camels) in 1984, fiance, now wife, said if I smoked she wouldn't kiss me...
Must have been the right decision, four kids and 34th Anniversary coming up in September.
And Chris is right, you don't know how bad you smell until you quit and then run into someone that does smoke. For the life of me, I can't imagine why anyone would pick up the habit anymore.
Trust me it does amongst other crippling problems. I see it everyday...
And the good Dr. has spoken...
mikewint
Captain
C
Apparently the following can't compare to your special insights:
More than 60 known carcinogens have been detected in cigarette smoke,
Hecht SS. Tobacco carcinogens, their biomarkers and tobacco-induced cancer. Nature reviews. Cancer. 2003;3:733–744.
which include polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs), nitrosamines, and aromatic amines; all play a crucial role in tumorigenesis. Research has shown that for every 15 cigarettes smoked, there is a DNA change which could cause a cell in the body to become cancerous.
Pfeifer GP, et al. Tobacco smoke carcinogens, DNA damage and p53 mutations in smoking-associated cancers. Oncogene. 2002;21:7435–7451.
Nicotine per se not only is the main addictive compound causing smokers to continue to their habit but also makes a genotoxic contribution to the pathogenesis of cancer.
Grando SA. Connections of nicotine to cancer. Nature reviews. Cancer. 2014;14:419–429.
One of the more recent findings in genome-wide association studies is that variants in the CHRNA5/A3/B4 cluster on chromosome 15q24-25.1 show a significant association with both nicotine dependence and lung cancer development.
Wen L, Jiang K, Yuan W, Cui W, Li MD. Contribution of Variants in CHRNA5/A3/B4 Gene Cluster on Chromosome 15 to Tobacco Smoking: From Genetic Association to Mechanism. Molecular neurobiology. 2016;53:472–484.
Approximately 70 of the chemicals in cigarettes are classified as carcinogens by several agencies.
Benzene is present in high levels in cigarette smoke and accounts for half of all human exposure to this hazardous chemical.
Formaldehyde in gaseous form, is responsible for some of the nose, throat, and eye irritation smokers experience when breathing in cigarette smoke.
Vinyl chloride is a man-made chemical that is used to make plastics. Smokers are exposed to it through cigarette filters.
Toxic Metals such as Arsenic, Lead and Cadmium are present in the soil are absorbed by the tobacco leaves.
Smokers typically have twice as much of these metals in their bodies as nonsmokers. Packing an extra punch are radioactive heavy metals such as Lead-210 (Pb-210) and polonium-210 (Po-210) that research has shown to be present in cigarette smoke.
Arsenic is incorporated into tobacco leaves through pesticides that are used in tobacco farming.
There are approximately 250 poisonous gases in cigarette smoke.
Ammonia it is added to boost the impact of nicotine on manufactured cigarettes.
Carbon monoxide is present in high levels in cigarette smoke.
Hydrogen cyanide can be found in cigarette smoke.
Nicotine a violent neurotoxin that is a used in pesticides and is the addictive element in cigarettes.
Chris pretty much said it all. Cancer is essentially simple to define, i.e. Accumulative damage to cellular genes that prevents them from performing their intended function and rapid uncontrolled cellular replication.
What is NOT easy or simple is twofold, i.e.: 1. The causative agent of the damage
Certain causative agents are unavoidable like age, gender, inherited genetic defects and skin type.
Environmental agents can in many cases be avoided like radon gas, UV radiation, and fine particulate matter. Naturally you have to be aware of their presence. Basements can be tested for radon and vented if necessary. You can hopefully avoid exposure or limit exposure to the sun and/or tanning booths, THAT "HEALTHY" sun tan. Particulate matter in the air such as in cities is tough to avoid on an every day basis but filter masks can be worn during any activity producing dusty conditions, like mowing the lawn or wind born dust conditions.
Occupational agents are very tough to avoid such as chemical carcinogenic compounds, heavy metals, radioactive materials, and asbestos. Occupations in which these agents occur LIMIT exposure BUT total elimination is all but impossible if you remain in that occupation.
Bacteria and Viruses are agents that are tough to avoid and total elimination is also impossible. Helicobacter pylori (H. pylori, which causes gastritis);
HBV, HCV (hepatitis viruses that cause hepatitis); HPV (human papilloma virus, which can causes changes to certain cells eg. Cervical cells);
EBV (Epstein-Barr virus, the herpes virus that causes inflammation of the throat lymphoid).
Lastly Lifestyle-related factors. This is the one area in which we can exert a lot of control especially the big three, SMOKING, ALCOHOL, and exposure to the UV radiation in sunlight.
2. an individuals response to a particular agent. Everyone's genetic make-up is unique and as such an individuals response to any and all of the above is impossible to predict except in terms of percentage odds for populations as a whole. Hence the anecdotal stories of "smoked 3 packs of cigarettes every day and lived to 98 when they were hit by a car".
If you REALLY believe this then decency and the Forum rules restrain me from commenting on your cerebral functioning abilities.
Apparently the following can't compare to your special insights:
More than 60 known carcinogens have been detected in cigarette smoke,
Hecht SS. Tobacco carcinogens, their biomarkers and tobacco-induced cancer. Nature reviews. Cancer. 2003;3:733–744.
which include polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs), nitrosamines, and aromatic amines; all play a crucial role in tumorigenesis. Research has shown that for every 15 cigarettes smoked, there is a DNA change which could cause a cell in the body to become cancerous.
Pfeifer GP, et al. Tobacco smoke carcinogens, DNA damage and p53 mutations in smoking-associated cancers. Oncogene. 2002;21:7435–7451.
Nicotine per se not only is the main addictive compound causing smokers to continue to their habit but also makes a genotoxic contribution to the pathogenesis of cancer.
Grando SA. Connections of nicotine to cancer. Nature reviews. Cancer. 2014;14:419–429.
One of the more recent findings in genome-wide association studies is that variants in the CHRNA5/A3/B4 cluster on chromosome 15q24-25.1 show a significant association with both nicotine dependence and lung cancer development.
Wen L, Jiang K, Yuan W, Cui W, Li MD. Contribution of Variants in CHRNA5/A3/B4 Gene Cluster on Chromosome 15 to Tobacco Smoking: From Genetic Association to Mechanism. Molecular neurobiology. 2016;53:472–484.
Approximately 70 of the chemicals in cigarettes are classified as carcinogens by several agencies.
Benzene is present in high levels in cigarette smoke and accounts for half of all human exposure to this hazardous chemical.
Formaldehyde in gaseous form, is responsible for some of the nose, throat, and eye irritation smokers experience when breathing in cigarette smoke.
Vinyl chloride is a man-made chemical that is used to make plastics. Smokers are exposed to it through cigarette filters.
Toxic Metals such as Arsenic, Lead and Cadmium are present in the soil are absorbed by the tobacco leaves.
Smokers typically have twice as much of these metals in their bodies as nonsmokers. Packing an extra punch are radioactive heavy metals such as Lead-210 (Pb-210) and polonium-210 (Po-210) that research has shown to be present in cigarette smoke.
Arsenic is incorporated into tobacco leaves through pesticides that are used in tobacco farming.
There are approximately 250 poisonous gases in cigarette smoke.
Ammonia it is added to boost the impact of nicotine on manufactured cigarettes.
Carbon monoxide is present in high levels in cigarette smoke.
Hydrogen cyanide can be found in cigarette smoke.
Nicotine a violent neurotoxin that is a used in pesticides and is the addictive element in cigarettes.
Chris pretty much said it all. Cancer is essentially simple to define, i.e. Accumulative damage to cellular genes that prevents them from performing their intended function and rapid uncontrolled cellular replication.
What is NOT easy or simple is twofold, i.e.: 1. The causative agent of the damage
Certain causative agents are unavoidable like age, gender, inherited genetic defects and skin type.
Environmental agents can in many cases be avoided like radon gas, UV radiation, and fine particulate matter. Naturally you have to be aware of their presence. Basements can be tested for radon and vented if necessary. You can hopefully avoid exposure or limit exposure to the sun and/or tanning booths, THAT "HEALTHY" sun tan. Particulate matter in the air such as in cities is tough to avoid on an every day basis but filter masks can be worn during any activity producing dusty conditions, like mowing the lawn or wind born dust conditions.
Occupational agents are very tough to avoid such as chemical carcinogenic compounds, heavy metals, radioactive materials, and asbestos. Occupations in which these agents occur LIMIT exposure BUT total elimination is all but impossible if you remain in that occupation.
Bacteria and Viruses are agents that are tough to avoid and total elimination is also impossible. Helicobacter pylori (H. pylori, which causes gastritis);
HBV, HCV (hepatitis viruses that cause hepatitis); HPV (human papilloma virus, which can causes changes to certain cells eg. Cervical cells);
EBV (Epstein-Barr virus, the herpes virus that causes inflammation of the throat lymphoid).
Lastly Lifestyle-related factors. This is the one area in which we can exert a lot of control especially the big three, SMOKING, ALCOHOL, and exposure to the UV radiation in sunlight.
2. an individuals response to a particular agent. Everyone's genetic make-up is unique and as such an individuals response to any and all of the above is impossible to predict except in terms of percentage odds for populations as a whole. Hence the anecdotal stories of "smoked 3 packs of cigarettes every day and lived to 98 when they were hit by a car".
My father in law to be died 3 months ago from COPD and a lung emphysema. Most probably, his COPD was at least to a good part caused by smoking.
Another point about smoking: It reduces the efficiency of how your lung works: Taking oxygene into your blood and giving away carbon dioxyde. Once this gets more serious, doing sports is less pleasant as before, thus most smokers start to move less. This also is a part of an unhealthy life style. Also, smoking promotes high blood pressure which is no good thing and, for the modelers of us: Smokers can´t keep their hands as calm as non-smokers. Thus, painting your models will give less satisfying results.
Another point about smoking: It reduces the efficiency of how your lung works: Taking oxygene into your blood and giving away carbon dioxyde. Once this gets more serious, doing sports is less pleasant as before, thus most smokers start to move less. This also is a part of an unhealthy life style. Also, smoking promotes high blood pressure which is no good thing and, for the modelers of us: Smokers can´t keep their hands as calm as non-smokers. Thus, painting your models will give less satisfying results.
That really made the decision difficult from using the funny icon or the informative icon. I went with informative in the interest of the greater good.
I thought it was the mix of nicotine and the tar? There's some people in Sweden who use a product called "Snus" which doesn't seem to have shown much correlation between cancer, as it's steam-cured, not fire-cured. That said, I've been told it might make one's breath smell like "Snus" if the "S", was replaced with an "A".
Wait, the same gene that makes some people become addicted, also contributes to them getting the cancer and dying? Boy, that's a gift that keeps on giving -- good thing I never picked up a cigarette.
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That's not true. Cancer is usually caused by a mutation in a gene. This mutation is in turn caused by environmental factors. Smoking can be (and usually is) an important factor.
The particular allele that you have of a gene could be beneficial for inducing uncontrolled growth when certain mutations occur. People which such an allele have a higher chance of getting cancer than others. That's the inherited ( or biological) part.
I can't help it, I'm a molecular biologistKeep that egumacation to yourself...
MiTasol
2nd Lieutenant
Which is why I despise all these one size fits all medical experts who, almost without exception, appear to look at a perceived problem with blinkers that exclude all the benefits of the things they are against (and no do not smoke and never have or would - t is an appalling addiction.)
I have a close relative with Leukemia. Since his properly trained/educated dietician put him on an extreme low carb diet he has put on weight, gained energy and looks much younger.
On top of that his hematologist has changed from monthly consultations and discussions on when to start chemo to 6 monthly consultations with no mention of chemo because his blood test results have gone from nasty to just inside the normal healthy range. Despite his example, which probably only applies to 5 to 10 percent of the population with leukemia and other specific illnesses, the one size fits all crowd are still screaming the everybody must cut fat intake and increase carb intake. I know that a high fat diet is bad news if you have prostate cancer because that cancer does feed on fat - and it also feeds off the chemicals the so called health professionals say are good for you when they tell you to eat food that has had the fat chemically removed. Think low fat milk, any monounsaturated fat food except avocados, etc etc.
This is the latest stupidity that one size fits all experts come up with when they exclude all the information that disagrees with their twisted beliefs the world's leading experts who say children should not be exposed to contact sports. Dylan Cleaver: Why I've changed my mind - kids shouldn't play contact sport because of head injury risk
So how and where are children going to learn both physical and hand-eye coordination, dexterity, strengthen their bodies and minds, give their lungs and other body parts good exercise, etc, etc, etc when they are wrapped in their cotton wool cocoons?
MiTasol
2nd Lieutenant
I will pay that one
MiTasol
most of the "one size fits all" fibe is coming from the media that brings the message to you. They tend to miss or ignore the always present details that actually matter.
mikewint
Captain
I'm not sure how you can claim that Cancer FEEDS on a particular food group. Certain fats (fatty acids) like certain proteins (amino acids) are essential to life since the human body does not have a metabolic pathway to produce them. They have to be provided by the diet.
Fats (fatty acids) fall into two main groups – saturated and unsaturated – based on their chemistry. There are three major classes of unsaturated fatty acids: omega-3, omega-6 and omega-9. The omega-6s and omega-3s are essential. The omega-9s are non-essential because the body can make them from other fatty acids.
The omega-6 fatty acids are linoleic acid (LA), and its derivatives, gamma-linolenic acid (GLA) and arachidonic acid (AA)
The omega-3 fatty acids are alpha-linolenic acid (ALA) and its derivatives, eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA).
Theoretically, only LA and ALA are absolutely essential. However, the fatty acids derived from them are also generally considered essential.
Cancer is simply not a disease with a cause and every human has cancerous cells present all the time.
Each time a cell divides it copies the 3 billion DNA 'letters' that make up its genetic code this is literally impossible to accomplish every time totally error free. Carcinogenic substances, such as those found in tobacco smoke, make this process more difficult and as such DNA damage becomes inevitable.
Because errors can and do occur cells also have proofreading machines that scan our DNA code, looking for faults and calling on molecular repair teams to fix any damage that's found. But like the copying process itself, they're not foolproof either and mistakes can slip through. A subtle genetic change might go unnoticed, or there could be so much damage that the repair machinery can't cope. But even if this happens, there are further checks in place to stop the damaged cell from dividing and potentially leading to a cancer. For example, the cell can effectively be forced to commit suicide so that it can't pass on its faulty DNA to new cells.
Again, like every biological process not fool-proof and some damaged cells can slip past these checks as well.
That's when the immune system comes into play, checking the genetic code of cells. If it appear out of the ordinary attacking and wiping them out. Frustratingly, cancer cells have evolved their own ways to defend from immune attack, such as dressing up in molecules that form an invisibility cloak. Ultimately, these can allow cancerous cells to evade destruction and go on to develop into the disease.
Now returning to The particular cancer PROSTATE mentioned above what is known, sort of is:
Age
Prostate cancer is rare in men younger than 40, but the chance of having prostate cancer rises rapidly after age 50. About 6 in 10 cases of prostate cancer are found in men older than 65.
Race/ethnicity
Prostate cancer occurs more often in African-American men and in Caribbean men of African ancestry than in men of other races. African-American men are also more than twice as likely to die of prostate cancer as white men. Prostate cancer occurs less often in Asian-American and Hispanic/Latino men than in non-Hispanic whites. The reasons for these racial and ethnic differences are not clear.
Geography
Prostate cancer is most common in North America, northwestern Europe, Australia, and on Caribbean islands. It is less common in Asia, Africa, Central America, and South America. Exactly why is unclear. One probable factor is the more intensive screening in developed countries. Another probable is lifestyle differences, e.g.: Asian Americans have a lower risk of prostate cancer than white Americans, but their risk is higher than that of men of similar backgrounds living in Asia.
Family history
Prostate cancer seems to run in some families, which suggests an inherited or genetic factor. However, most prostate cancers still occur in men without a family history of it. Having a father with prostate cancer more than doubles a man's risk. The risk is even higher for men who have a brother with the disease. The risk increases even higher for men with several affected relatives, particularly if their relatives were young when the cancer was found.
Gene changes
Several inherited gene changes seem to raise prostate cancer risk, but they probably account for only a small percentage of cases overall. For example:
Inherited mutations of the BRCA1 or BRCA2 genes raise the risk of breast and ovarian cancers in some families. Mutations in these genes (especially in BRCA2) may also increase prostate cancer risk in men.
Men with Lynch syndrome (also known as hereditary non-polyposis colorectal cancer, or HNPCC), a condition caused by inherited gene changes, have an increased risk for a number of cancers, includiFactors that are still unclear with contradictory studies concerning the link.
Diet
The exact role of diet is not clear. Men who eat a lot of red meat or high-fat dairy products appear to have a slightly higher chance of getting prostate cancer. However, at the same time, these men also tend to eat fewer fruits and vegetables.
Some studies have suggested that men who consume a lot of calcium may have a higher risk of developing prostate cancer. Dairy foods obviously fall into this category. But most studies have not found such a link with the levels of calcium found in the average diet, and it's important to note that calcium is known to have other important health benefits.
Obesity
Being obese does not seem to increase the overall risk of getting prostate cancer.
Some studies have found that obese men have a lower risk of getting a low-grade form of the disease, but a higher risk of getting more aggressive prostate cancer.
Some studies have also found that obese men may be at greater risk for having more advanced prostate cancer and of dying from prostate cancer, but not all studies have found this.
Smoking
Most studies have not found a link between smoking and getting prostate cancer. Some research has linked smoking to a possible small increased the risk of dying from prostate cancer.
Chemical exposures
There is some evidence that firefighters can be exposed to chemicals that may increase their risk of prostate cancer. A few studies have suggested a possible link between exposure to Agent Orange, and the risk of prostate cancer, although not all studies have found such a link. The Institute of Medicine considers there to be "limited/suggestive evidence" of a link between Agent Orange exposure and prostate cancer.
Inflammation of the prostate
Some studies have suggested that prostatitis may be linked to an increased risk of prostate cancer, but other studies have not found such a link. Inflammation is often seen in samples of prostate tissue that also contain cancer. So this link is still unclear
Sexually transmitted infections
STDs like gonorrhea or Chlamydia can lead to inflammation of the prostate. As such, they might increase the risk of prostate cancer. So far, studies have not agreed, and no firm conclusions have been reached.
Vasectomy
Some studies have suggested that men who have had a vasectomy have a slightly increased risk for prostate cancer, but other studies have not found this.
fubar57
General
Jaysus Mike, it would have been quicker just to copy/paste the link
