Is This Genuine?

[Negative Creep]

1915 ARMY BIBLE.. With a 1916 Bullet Head for sale - TradeMe.co.nz - New Zealand


What do you think? I know nothing about ballistics but could a bullet really end up lodged in that way?

 

[Matt308]

While not unheard of (in the civil war I recall reading about a nurse that was deduced to actually have been impregnated with a stray ball that had hit a soldiers testicles and then hit her in her dropped eggs) Say what you will, I read it.

What looks fake to me is the .303 bullet. It looks staged. Something that old, from that chaotic situation, and displayed in an open book and not be lost? I wouldn't pay $1 for it without some SERIOUS pedigree. I call bullshit.

 

[Colin1]

If I was to make an informed guess
for that round to have stopped at the Bible, it would have needed to hit something else immediately prior and substantially, in order for the round to slow sufficiently to allow the Bible to catch and retain it. I see no deformation in the body of the warhead to suggest it's actually hit anything.

I don't know if there'd be any chemical evidence on the base of the warhead to prove that it's been fired or if there was, whether it would still be there after 90-odd years.

 

[Matt308]

.

 

[vikingBerserker]

As Matt stated in his Hallmark card, I have to agree. Perhaps the bible was really shot, but I suspect that is not the original bullet. Paper ca be pretty tough and if it really went that far into it, I would have thought the bullet would have been smashed a bit. It looks too pristine.

 

[Airframes]

The bullet shown in profile in one of the photos has been fired. There is slight compression of the head at the tip, and the cupro-nickel jacket bears the marks froms the lands, the rifling of the barrel. That's not to say it is the actual buulet which allegedly penetrated the Bible, but, from the shape of the tail, it is from the First World War period - later .303 ball ammunition used a 'boat-tailed' bullet head. It's not impossible that the bullet/a bullet could penetrate and then stop, after entering the book end on, especially if previously deflected or at or near the end of it's maximum velocity, as the separate leaves of the pages would act as a baffle, decreasing velocity relatively rapidly. If the bullet had impacted on the face of the book/pages, the resistance would have been less and, even if it's energy was almost spent, the bullet would very probably have exited out the opposite side.
Hoax, BS or not, the puzzling thing is, given the round is a .303, as presumed from the documentation, and not an Axis 7.92mm, who was shooting at whom?!!

 

[timshatz]

in the civil war I recall reading about a nurse that was deduced to actually have been impregnated with a stray ball that had hit a soldiers testicles and then hit her in her dropped eggs) .

I guess the immaculate conception just wasn't going to work in her case....

 

[RabidAlien]

I guess the immaculate conception just wasn't going to work in her case....

Mythbusters disproved that one.

 

[GrauGeist]

I agree, Terry...why is a .303 in the end of the Bible? A little "friendly-fire" there?

And of all of the Bibles I have seen struck by bullets, they've usually impacted the Face or the back cover since they've usually been carried in a pocket. I could figure this Bible was in a pack, perhaps, making it edge-on to the bullet's path?

In my limited experience, though, it would seem that a bullet of that caliber (.303 or 7x57, etc) would travel further through a book of that size if it did enter the edge instead of the face. Unless it was at the limit of it's range and had expended most of it's energy...

 

[Airframes]

Yes Chris, that's what I meant. If the bullet had been deflected, passed through other material(s), or was near the end of its effective 'energy range', then the leaves of the book, end on, would have some effect in slowing the bullet further. This is due to the effect of the preceding shock wave, and the bullet itself, causing the individual leaves to attempt to fan out, increasing the overall area, albeit minutely, and absorbing both shock and impact. Hitting the face of the book, under the same conditions, the bullet would probably pass straight through, as the shock wave would 'bend' and deform the once flat and compact impact area, offering less resistance.
Of course, within the bounds of effective energy/velocity, the bullet would pass through at whichever angle, or part, the book was penetrated. But, some weird things can happen in ballistics. I've seen 7.62mm rounds penetrate engine blocks, whilst the same type of bullets, under similar conditions, have been deflected off car bodywork.
You have to wonder though - maybe the Bible did stop,the bullet - after it had passed through the body of the man who's haversack it was in!!!

 

[KMeyrick]

Just to add my 2 cents.... and knowing next to nothing about era bullets.... I do know books and have a family bible from around the same time.

1. Pages of the bible are too white. A book, even bound will yellow from the edges out. There is no yellow around the edges of the pages.

2. the white pages seem to be the wrong quality of paper that was used to print bibles in the early 1900's. It was usually much lighter weight to keep costs down for the masses.

My great, great uncle was a preacher and even his really expensive (at that time) bible has really light weight pages.... so much so that these years later care is needed to turn the pages.

The histortian side of me says that bible is not from the 1915's.

 

[evangilder]

AHem...bullsh...ahem...it. The military is full of stories of bibles saving lives from bullets, shrapnel, etc. This sounds like someone trying to cash in on a legend. Would you be willing to shell out that much money to someone who can't even spell auction? This thing stinks to high heaven.

Oh look, it closed with no one buying....BIG surprise.

 

[wheelsup_cavu]

Current bid: $110,100.00
Reserve not met

Someone was willing to part with much cash and the reserve wasn't met.

I don't buy the whole story but this makes it even tougher.

Have paper work to prove a back up claims Auction winner can have a Photo copy of said documents we will hold onto originals.....

His not being willing to part with the original documentation is another flag to me.


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