Kobe Bryant Crash

[gumbyk]

Commercial pilots without instrument ratings are very rare and will not get much work. Most of the ones I know are towing gliders or crop dusters

There aren't too many IFR qualified helicopter pilots down here in NZ, mainly those doing offshore support. I can't understand requiring an IFR rating for a helicopter pilot, even a commercial one.

Often a VFR pilot is safer in these situations because they have a clearer line of 'no-go'. If you're an IFR capable pilot, in a VFR equipped aircraft, you're more comfortable pushing the envelope.

 

[PWR4360-59B]

I don't know about now, but back in the 70's a private pilot got instrument training, no not flying an IFR flight plan but some time flying and controlling the plane on instruments, night flight in a very dark area is similar to IMC conditions. Some of us low timers had no problems depending on the instruments and recovering from an unusual attitude.
This day and age there is no excuse for even an inexperienced pilot going out of control from entering IMC, all planes should be equiped with GPS synthetic vision and enhanced vision as well as TCAS , Terrain avoidance systems, and such should be incorporated into those systems. All for hire aircraft especially should have to have it. Those systems give a real time view of what the plane is flying over even in a dense cloud. And let you know where the other planes are that could run into you. All planes should have altitude reporting transponders.

 

[XBe02Drvr]

All planes should have altitude reporting transponders.

Even no-electric system ragwing cubs, Aeroncas, and T-crafts hedgehopping in the desert miles from any controlled airspace or radar coverage? Or should we just bite the bullet and outlaw them entirely? Declare the EAA and the SSA terrorist organizations? They're almost there with ADS-B. You can't even fly a model airplane now unless it and you are registered for drone operations and are ADS-B compliant.
Cheery, huh?
Wes

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I don't know about now, but back in the 70's a private pilot got instrument training, no not flying an IFR flight plan but some time flying and controlling the plane on instruments, night flight in a very dark area is similar to IMC conditions. Some of us low timers had no problems depending on the instruments and recovering from an unusual attitude.

Private pilots today still do "hood training". During my training I did 4 hours under the hood. Learning how to maneuver, navigate, do stalls etc., under instruments.

This day and age there is no excuse for even an inexperienced pilot going out of control from entering IMC, all planes should be equiped with GPS synthetic vision and enhanced vision as well as TCAS , Terrain avoidance systems, and such should be incorporated into those systems. All for hire aircraft especially should have to have it. Those systems give a real time view of what the plane is flying over even in a dense cloud. And let you know where the other planes are that could run into you. All planes should have altitude reporting transponders.

And sorry, but you would unfortunately be wrong. Since you are specifically referring to inexperienced pilots, that would mostly be private aircraft. Many planes are not equipped with GPS (which will not prevent you from getting visual illusions such as spacial disorientation anyhow). Most non-commercial or charter aircraft do not have a TCAS either.

As for, for hire aircraft, that is such a broad term. A Piper Cub can be a for hire aircraft for instance. There is no law disctating that it has to have that equipment. Only what types of conditions you can fly in with said equipment.

And finally as stated above, none of that equipment will stop any pilot from spacial disorientation or any other other visual illusion caused by loss of visual reference. Once you get those illusions, its very hard to combat them, even with instruments because you begin to second guess the instruments.

the only "non excuse" is to stay on the ground when the weather is questionable.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Perhaps the future is pilotless VIP charter helicopters. Removing the pilot seems to be removing the cause of these IMC mishaps.

 

[XBe02Drvr]

Perhaps the future is pilotless VIP charter helicopters. Removing the pilot seems to be removing the cause of these IMC mishaps.

The technology requires a LOT of maturing before that becomes feasible. Not in my lifetime. Over my dead body.
Cheers,
Wes

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Perhaps the future is pilotless VIP charter helicopters. Removing the pilot seems to be removing the cause of these IMC mishaps.

Hopefully not. I'll take the human desire to survive over a computer in an emergency situation 9 out of 10 times.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Human error is the cause of probably most injuries and deaths in every aspect of our lives.

Do we replace Dr.'s for instance with robots too?

 

[XBe02Drvr]

Do we replace Dr.'s for instance with robots too?

They've already got apps that do better than the average Dr. at diagnosing obscure forms of cancer.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

They've already got apps that do better than the average Dr. at diagnosing obscure forms of cancer.

i'm referring to performing surgeries.

 

[mikewint]

Let's imagine 1000 or so cars traveling at 70 mph 5 feet or so apart all under computer control on some highway of the future. Then a momentary power surge/outage/glitch and control fails for a second or two. Obviously the cars will have redundant safeties but all it takes is for one or two of those to fail...
How abou a sky full of commercial aircraft taking off and landing a few minutes apart all under nice safe computer control...then hiccup....

 

[XBe02Drvr]

i'm referring to performing surgeries.

Scary thought, but what does a surgeon do? Analyze symptoms and history, then compare to knowledge and experience. If a standard procedure is indicated, proceed according to protocol, observing for abnormalities and accomodating as necessary. These processes are not too far beyond what industrial robotics are currently capable of. Consultation, innovation, and bedside manner still need a lot of work, but who wouldn't like to swim up from under the anesthesia to be welcomed by an observant, intelligent Siri?
Again, scary thought!
Cheers,
Wes

 

[mikewint]

"To Serve and Obey and Guard men from Harm" - "With Folded Hands" (1947) by Jack Williamson.
"the best possible machines, designed with the best of intentions, become the ultimate horror"
-Jack Williamson on The Humanoids

 

[gumbyk]

Human error is the cause of probably most injuries and deaths in every aspect of our lives.

Do we replace Dr.'s for instance with robots too?

Well, a Dr's far more likely to kill you than a pilot.

 

[XBe02Drvr]

How abou a sky full of commercial aircraft taking off and landing a few minutes apart all under nice safe computer control...then hiccup....

That computer control would have to be a distributed redundant system like FBW, but what worries me is not hiccup, but hack, or maybe even EMP.
ADS and TCAS technologies could be the basis for airborne autonomous conflict resolution, reducing dependence on centralized control computers. Great idea until the day the entire GPS constellation gets vaporized at the same time. We're the only nation in the world that is planning on decommissioning all its surface based air navigation systems.
Cheery thought, huh?
Wes

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Well, a Dr's far more likely to kill you than a pilot.

Agreed on that 100%

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Scary thought, but what does a surgeon do? Analyze symptoms and history, then compare to knowledge and experience. If a standard procedure is indicated, proceed according to protocol, observing for abnormalities and accomodating as necessary. These processes are not too far beyond what industrial robotics are currently capable of. Consultation, innovation, and bedside manner still need a lot of work, but who wouldn't like to swim up from under the anesthesia to be welcomed by an observant, intelligent Siri?
Again, scary thought!
Cheers,
Wes

the problem is when something goes against what it is programmed to do

 

[gumbyk]

Agreed on that 100%

In the words of Bill Voss (ex chair of Helicopter Safety International) "the difference is, they kill people one at a time"

 

[XBe02Drvr]

the problem is when something goes against what it is programmed to do

Just like aviation; rules written in blood. That patient dies, written off to collateral damage, and the software gets revised yet again.

 

[gumbyk]

Just like aviation; rules written in blood. That patient dies, written off to collateral damage, and the software gets revised yet again.

Nothing like aviation... The safety culture isn't there in medicine to be able to learn from mistakes. The medical field almost always write deaths off as 'one of those things' and unavoidable - something aviation dismissed a long time ago.

I'd hate to think what would happen if they got involved in the programming of AI for medical procedures.