Lightning Guy
Master Sergeant
- 2,511
- Apr 29, 2004
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lesofprimus said:Ur not taking into account the accuracy of the certain pilot.. U know as well as I do that some pilots had a much higher accuracy rating than some others....
I have seen, as Im sure u have seen, movie clips of guys placing a 30mm shell right into the sweet spot at 300 meters.....
Those stats u put up are nice for a generic look, but to get into a detailed conversation, those #'s dont help much.... We all know that a .50 cal fired faster and had a higher probability of hitting..... Anything else is pumping sunshine up our asses, cause individual accuracy and combat experience change those #'s dramatically in certain circumstances....
BUT....... Ur point is well-recieved... Ud be better off by far with the .50's over the cannons, in a dogfight...
Thats a load of crap....The whole "skill" of the pilot issue is mute.
Reference??? No..... But i do specifically recall seeing a certain video clip where an Fw-190A-8 comes up, u see the bracketing of the smaller MG's, then 3-4 cannon rounds that strike the fuselage, no misses.... The bomber rolls off to the left and starts breaking up....As far as individual pilots landing a 30mm in the sweet spot from 300 meters... first off can you reference this? A single shot, not after a lot of misses please.
Lightning Guy said:I've never been a fan of the WWII 30mm weapons in a dogfight for all of the reasons that have been mentioned.
One thing that worked against the P-80 is the realtively low ammo load. At 1200rpm, 200 rounds of ammo will only last 10secs. That being said, the combat endurance of the P-80 would be relatively low and the pilot would need to be an accurate shooter to get the most out of his ammo.
Lightning Guy said:I've never been a fan of the WWII 30mm weapons in a dogfight for all of the reasons that have been mentioned.
One thing that worked against the P-80 is the realtively low ammo load. At 1200rpm, 200 rounds of ammo will only last 10secs. That being said, the combat endurance of the P-80 would be relatively low and the pilot would need to be an accurate shooter to get the most out of his ammo.
RG_Lunatic said:Look, the skill issue is mute because no matter the pilot, he will do better with the higher velocity guns (all other factors being equal). If he's a crappy shot, he's a crappy shot, but he will still do better.
Or are you arguing that Axis pilots were just better shots than allied pilots? If so that is pure crap.
=S=
Lunatic
GermansRGeniuses said:RG_Lunatic said:Look, the skill issue is mute because no matter the pilot, he will do better with the higher velocity guns (all other factors being equal). If he's a crappy shot, he's a crappy shot, but he will still do better.
Or are you arguing that Axis pilots were just better shots than allied pilots? If so that is pure crap.
=S=
Lunatic
Actually, the thing about the pilots isn't entirely true...
I happen to be quite the pilot in flight sims, but my aim is ATROCIOUS!
GermansRGeniuses said:True, but as I said, the resulting damage is less.
GermansRGeniuses said:We're both forgetting something that partially ends this argument...
The K-14 lead computing gunsight!
DaveB.inVa said:Dogfighting with a big heavy cannon is akin to going bird hunting with a deer rifle! You might get a hit in somewhere, and when you do you can be pretty sure its a kill, but the chances of that happening are low. Using a shotgun you put a good spread out there. Sure a lot of the pellets are going to miss, but youve got a lot more in the air so youve got more chances for a hit. Thats why you go bird hunting with a shotgun.
DaveB.inVa said:If both pilots are average then Id put my money on the guy with the highest rate of fire. You might have one guy whos God's gift to cockpit and can throw 30mm all day with excellent accuracy, but thats just one guy. There are a lot more average joes out there, and for the average joe Id go with the .50.
kiwimac said:There can be no doubt that IF a pilot can hit an enemy aircraft with his guns, a higher calibre weapon will do more damage BUT there is a lot of pilot skill there too.
Erich Hartmann managed to shoot down a Sturmovik on ONE occasion with a single well placed shot, Von Richthofen in WW1 managed the same feat ONCE.
No matter the size of the weapon skill plays an emormous part.
Kiwimac