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Bf 109E is/was vastly better than any Yak fighter since it was available for two years when Yak fighters were not available - 1939 to 1940.
Any model of P-40 and any Yak were competitive if the Bf 109s were at low-ish altitudes, no such luck above 3-4 km.
Spitfire IX vs. Bf 109E? That is a joke. At low and medium altitudes Spitfire IX have had performance parity vs. German opposition, it edged them out above 25000 ft, bar the 109s with AS engine and DB 605D (in the 109G-10s and K-4s mostly).
This is not borne out in the combat record over North Africa or Malta.The 109F-4 was with clear edge vs any Mk.V,
By that logic the Gloster Gladiator is better than both... when the Yak 1 and Yak 7 appeared on the battlefields in Russia bf 109E were still in use, albeit mostly relegated to Jabo formations and so on. Similarly when the Tomahawk appeared in North Africa, 109E were still around, 109F were brojught in to replace them but that was not an instant process. As far as performance goes, I think perhaps you are ignoring the later Yak 1B, Yak 7B etc.
Yes - exactly- and what percentage of combats on the Russian Front, the only place where the Yak lived, took place above 3-4km?
When the Spit IX was deployed in North Africa in 1942 there were still Bf 109E equipping squadrons, with plenty of 109F and a good number of G-2 and G-4, and some G-6 in 1943. The Spit IX squadrons wrought havoc against them all.
This is not borne out in the combat record over North Africa or Malta.
Per Shores Mediterranean Air War series, the Spit Vc was out-fighting 109F and G2, and the Spit IX was dominating them.
There was no real new advantage being brought by Yak-1B or -7B, apart from extra 100 HP under 3 km, and, despite that, a performance loss due to poor fit & finish.
The Bf 109Fs were predominant fighter models in 1941, especially once Op
That Yaks were underperforming above 4 km was not a feature, but a bug. Bf 109s were able to do whatever the Yaks did, plus perform at high altitudes, plus with greater range.
Do these excuses work both ways? We glorify German pilots for shooting down scores of biplanes and open cockpit I-16s with no radios, but somehow when the weather is bad or the other side deploys more planes their victories are irrelevant?Against the 109Es and G-6s - certainly. There is a small thing of having a numerical superiority, too.
Seems like that combat record over Soviet Union does not matter.
It also seems like the Spit VC was barely holding it's own vs. Zeros, yet was outfighting the 109Fs and G2s, all while RAF brass made a descision not to press on with VC in 1943, but to concentrate on VB?
... RAF brass made a descision not to press on with VC in 1943, but to concentrate on VB ...
As for the Soviet Union I do think it does matter, but it also merits a closer look. As I mentioned, the tipping point of Luftwaffe dominance began to shift after Stalingrad. This coincides with the arrival of the Yak-1B, Yak-9, and La 5 on the battlefield. The test of who was superior to whom did not come out in favor of the Aryan super -race in the long run, did it? And that wasn't simply due to Germans freezing in the Russian winter. Somebody shot down most of those 30,000 Bf 109s that were built. And all the Fw 190s too.
Based on Shores stats
The Soviets were still losing 3 aircraft for every plane lost by the Luftwaffe in 1944; these are operational losses too all causes. This despite overwhelming numerical superiotity.
What stats?
Soviet losses were in the order of 88000, 46000 of them operational. The 20000 in 1941 were total losses, with some 10600 being operational.
Total German losses may well have been 28000, but operationally about 15000.
The operational loss ratios 1941-1944 were more than 3 to 1 every year for the Soviets compared to the Luftwaffe; losses of the smaller Axis will naturally lower the overall ratio, but probably not much.
I doubt that there are any loss figures for air to air, so what that ratio is anyone's guess.
I've no time for check, but i near sure that Spit IX was not deployed in ME/NA in 1942. If there were some Emil in the 42 were in ground attack staffeln.
Nikademus time ago writed "My estimate suggests 144 Spitfires in trade for 82 Bf-109's for air to air based on a study of Shores's Malta book" he was taking of '42.
Perhaps my last participation for this thread: losses of the Soviet and German A/C, per Soviet records. Chapters of interest, in Spanish, are 4. Bajas de la aviación nazi and 5. Bajas de la aviacion soviética. LINK
Easy to comprehend even without translation.
Rather a disingenuous statistic as it is ignoring the fact the RAF were constantly intercepting bomber raids not duelling with 109's in isolation!
The 109's had only the RAF fighters to engage!
Suffice to say the arrival of the Spit V changed the air battle considerably and ultimately defeated the Luftwaffe again.
Bit silly to try and tot up fighters alone in a strategic battle like Malta!
I've no time for check, but i near sure that Spit IX was not deployed in ME/NA in 1942. If there were some Emil in the 42 were in ground attack staffeln.
Nikademus time ago writed "My estimate suggests 144 Spitfires in trade for 82 Bf-109's for air to air based on a study of Shores's Malta book" he was taking of '42.
I'm not certain what "Shores Malta book" is precisely - I know he is a prolific author and has written numerous books on the Air War in WW2, but I have his two most recent Mediterranean Air War books (Vols II and III, & eagerly awaiting Vol IV later this year) and I can tell you it's tricky determining who shot down what since by the second half of 1942 in particular, most days include pilots of multiple aircraft types on both sides making claims.
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Certainly tricky. Fantastic book but things tend to be a bit slipperier than in his later works. Shores' game has certainly reached new levels in his latest books.
When you have big, confused dogfights in three languages with the results tending to end up in the sea - it makes for a few holes in the story
I've checked also for the Emil at 1/11/42 there were on strenght 39 Emil on all the Jagd unit of LW, so this include the jabo staffeln, just for clear the total of fighter was 1452