Need Drawings For Hamilton Standard 6353A18 & 6477A0 Props

[Old MacDonald]

These are the two Ham Standard props used on B-24s, the 6477A0 being the later and much more common "paddle blade" variant. I thought I saw a website years ago that posted most or all the WW II & earlier Ham Standard prop drawings, but can't find it now. Anybody have a source for these two drawings??

TIA.

OM

 

[fubar57]

Might be something here...1944 Tech manual aircraft propellers

 

[Old MacDonald]

Outstanding resource, and thanks! The later TO even has a photo showing the earlier (6353A18) "narrow" Ham Standard prop in place on a B-24D.

Unfortunately still no engineering-type drawings of the two prop blades. My intention is to help people (particularly modelers) understand the difference between the B-24D's "narrow" and "paddle blade" Ham Standard props.

The problem is they're not as different as some may think. I've seen references to "needle" props on B-24s, which may be a useful label for the earliest LB-30s that had--for a while--Curtiss Electric props that really did have rather narrow width, but that's not a good word to describe the early "narrow" Ham Standards that replaced the CEs on most LB-30s and were mounted on many or most of the earliest B-24Ds.

OM

 

[Michael Hope]

Sorry I but the Hamilton Standard/Sundstrand/UTC Documents are copyrighted, so official manufacturer documents are not legal to post. I have seen an old military technical order for Hamilton Standard blade overhaul, from the early 50's, that had the blade dimensions for minimums, but also for making the required templates for blade angle checking, so it included dimensions for overall width, plus the face alignment figures every 10 percent across the width, and 2.5 percent for the leading edge on both the face and cambered side of the blade, for every blade station along the blade. I do not have access to this document any more.

 

[Old MacDonald]

Hi Michael

Interesting the drawings are copyrighted since these props were always GFE (Government Furnished Equipment) to Boeing and Consolidated, among others. The "paddle blade" prop, at least, was developed under US government contract, so I suspect the USG owns the rights to those drawings.

I wonder if the National Air & Space Museum has copies of these drawings in their vast collection. I'll have to ping them to see.

Do you recall the TO number or name? Thanks for the lead!

 

[Michael Hope]

Hi Michael

Interesting the drawings are copyrighted since these props were always GFE (Government Furnished Equipment) to Boeing and Consolidated, among others. The "paddle blade" prop, at least, was developed under US government contract, so I suspect the USG owns the rights to those drawings.

I wonder if the National Air & Space Museum has copies of these drawings in their vast collection. I'll have to ping them to see.

Do you recall the TO number or name? Thanks for the lead!

I should have been more specific, the Current Hamilton documents/manuals are copy righted, the blade dimensions are found in their manual 130B. I do not remember the TO number as it has been many years since I have seen it.

 

[Old MacDonald]

Hi Michael

Again very helpful--particularly the Ham Standard manual number, and thanks. Do you happen to recall whether the TO you saw was Army, or Air Force, and approximately what time period it was issues (WW II, postwar, etc.)?

OM

 

[Michael Hope]

Hi Michael

Again very helpful--particularly the Ham Standard manual number, and thanks. Do you happen to recall whether the TO you saw was Army, or Air Force, and approximately what time period it was issues (WW II, postwar, etc.)?

OM

It was an RCAF document cover on a US document, the copy that I say was received about 1952, so probably from late 40's, I do not know what the issue date would be or if Army or Air Force, it has been about 20 years since I last say it.

 

[Old MacDonald]

HI Michael

Good--gives me a place to start looking since my searches so far have been unproductive.

 

[Hueyman]

Hi dude

I'm a Propeller lover... love to 3D model these ones.

Don't have the original building technical drawings ( and honestly after years of researches, not sure anyone still have them, and UTC Aerospace is not keen to help )

But I do own a 6477A-0 blade that I scanned with photogrametry, it helped me have great template and cross section to model one to great accuracy..

May it helps you ?

Stay in touch !

Hueyman

 

[Old MacDonald]

Hey Huey

BEAUTIFUL job on the 3D work! It will really help if I can get a "front" view of one blade (not the whole prop), since my intent is to illustrate to modelers and historians the difference between the two Ham Standard blades. Often it's useful to ID the blade type in a photo as an aid to narrowing down the identification of the aircraft in the photo. I'll PM you with my email (when I figure out how to PM through this website!). Thanks much.

 

[Wurger]

Move the coursor over the Hueyman's avatar above his nick on the left of his post. The small popup window will appear. There you can find Start Conversation button. Just click it.

 

[Old MacDonald]

Thanks!

 

[Sutts]

Hi dude

I'm a Propeller lover... love to 3D model these ones.

Don't have the original building technical drawings ( and honestly after years of researches, not sure anyone still have them, and UTC Aerospace is not keen to help )

But I do own a 6477A-0 blade that I scanned with photogrametry, it helped me have great template and cross section to model one to great accuracy..

May it helps you ?

View attachment 526975


View attachment 526976

View attachment 526977

View attachment 526978


Stay in touch !

Hueyman

Wow, that's some seriously impressive work Hueyman, great effort. Must look into photogrammetry - there are so many subcontracted parts on wartime aircraft where the plans are impossible to find.

 

[Michael Hope]

HI Michael

Good--gives me a place to start looking since my searches so far have been unproductive.

I have found the the military EO it is "EO 15-30A". I have the size specifications for the 6501 series blades if you want that in PDF format.

 

[aircraftclocks]

I have found the the military EO it is "EO 15-30A". I have the size specifications for the 6501 series blades if you want that in PDF format.

I find I have a copy of EO 15-30-2, EO 15-30-2A, EO 15-30-9, EO-30AB-2G and EO 30AB-2C. Is it possible to get a copy of EO 15-30A?
I have a large number of prop dimensions taken from various sources. All are "standardised" at given station points and you need extra datum reference information in order to produce the profile. If you would like this for a given blade, drop me a message.
The information on the 6501 would be of interest as well.

 

[MiTasol]

The attached US tech orders index pages may help locate what you are after from the USAFM or NASM or other sources.

The first list is 1943 and second 1946. Try and find an index from the 50s, as I am sure there was a military blade overhaul manual for HS 23E50's with all blade specs when I worked on HS overhaul in 1962. Log in | AirCorps Library has an index dated 49 but it does not have what you want

Happy hunting

 

[Old MacDonald]

Hey MT

Perfect timing! I'm headed to NARA on Friday and will look for a copy there. Both blades should be in both versions. Will try the other two places if NARA doesn't have it available (or not indexed, which is functionally the same thing).

 

[MiTasol]

Hi Old Mac
Did you strike lucky?
Seems to me that 03-20CC-1 would be the best bet

 

[Old MacDonald]

Partial success. I haven't yet had time to schedule a trip to the NARA to see whether they have that manual in their collection. It doesn't show up in their index, but a ton of stuff that is there for sure also does not show up. Crap shoot, but I'll certainly include it in my searches the next time I go. All NARA research rooms are closed until further notice due to the Wuhan virus, so it's hard to tell when I'll be able to go back.

Thanks for checking!