Nice CGI from IJN perspective

[nuuumannn]

I know, right? You'd think we were like pre-1914 England or something.

Oh, not quite, not yet anyway. Great Britain mastered subjugation on a global scale quite unlike any other master race, self declared or otherwise. The USA has a long way to go before it ever matches the scope and size of the British Empire. To begin with, it has to sort out its obvious internal differences.

Also, I hope you guys realise that I made these comments with my tongue firmly planted in cheek! (being American, you might need that pointed out to you...)

 

[jetcal1]

Oh, not quite, not yet anyway. Great Britain mastered subjugation on a global scale quite unlike any other master race, self declared or otherwise. The USA has a long way to go before it ever matches the scope and size of the British Empire. To begin with, it has to sort out its obvious internal differences.

Also, I hope you guys realise that I made these comments with my tongue firmly planted in cheek! (being American, you might need that pointed out to you...)

Dude, didn't I have the smiley face to tell you I was giving you a ration of shitt?

 

[nuuumannn]

Dude, didn't I have the smiley face to tell you I was giving you a ration of shitt?

Obviously, but it does need to be pointed out that Great Britain still holds the Number one spot for being the biggest dirtbags to indigenous races in world history, regardless of how hard modern superpowers try...

 

[SaparotRob]

Obviously, but it does need to be pointed out that Great Britain still holds the Number one spot for being the biggest dirtbags to indigenous races in world history, regardless of how hard modern superpowers try...

Was that a challenge?

 

[jetcal1]

I met an APCM in 1974 who had been in for 40 years, and was flying left seat in a C9 with his son in law and CO, a newly frocked Rear Admiral as FO. He enlisted in 1934 and became an ordie, then a tail gunner, then sent to flight school under the cadet program, where he was denied commissioning due to what he described as a "couth deficit". Flew Helldivers (the biplane version), F4Fs and F6Fs in the RAG squadrons, then the early jets. He said he spent WWII stuck as an instructor in various RAG squadrons despite frantic efforts to get assigned to a deploying squadron. His SIL, the Admiral, said: "He shot himself in the foot by getting too good at what he did. They wouldn't let him go. Trained five Hellcat aces!"
This was their last trip together, as the new Admiral was being relieved as CO of the composite squadron and "kicked upstairs" to a Pentagon staff billet.

Master Chief Cleveland also had a "couth deficit".
He came down to our shop (IM-2 400) after an incident where the DivO went after a TAD Sailor and proceeded to rip our DivO a new assshole in front of about 30 white hats and two Chiefs. His CO got called. He came down, heard the Chiefs explanation and in front of the humiliated O-3 and the rest of us? Said; "Okay Master Chief, carry-on". (The DIvO was a prick who had no business being commissioned.)

 

[jetcal1]

Obviously, but it does need to be pointed out that Great Britain still holds the Number one spot for being the biggest dirtbags to indigenous races in world history, regardless of how hard modern superpowers try...

My advice is keep it in the context of the philosophies of the time and carry on. (You know the only difference between an American and a Aussie? The Aussie got caught. (Unless you're from Georgia.)

 

[nuuumannn]

Was that a challenge?

Ha haaa! You mean you haven't started?

(You know the only difference between an American and a Aussie? The Aussie got caught.

Now you're really betraying your origins... So, to avoid further thread drift, I'll take a break and have a drink.

 

[jetcal1]

Please excuse my ignorance.
AFCM?
VOC DET?

Sorry.
AFCM is a E-9 Master Chief that combined a few "rates" such as airframes, engines, hydraulics. By the time you make E-9? You're expected to know the systems. To continue on that "theme" a Navy E-9 in the aviation electrical, fire control, or electronics fields would be an AVCM and expected to have mastered anything that had a wire attached to it.

VOC is an old, old squadron designation for Composite Spotting Squadron V = Fixed Wing, O = Observation C= Composite that flew the float planes off ships like cruisers and battleships during WWII.

 

[XBe02Drvr]

So, to avoid further thread drift, I'll take a break and have a drink.

Great idea! I think I'll do likewise.

 

[SaparotRob]

Great minds think alike.

 

[jetcal1]

Ha haaa! You mean you haven't started?



Now you're really betraying your origins... So, to avoid further thread drift, I'll take a break and have a drink.

I had fun with that comment in Perth many decades ago. Although at 21, I didn't realize how much it would upset the people who were in their 60's. (Or maybe 70's)

On a serious note, a Jamaican friend last year explained to me....She said "Of course they were offended. You might have been talking about their grandparents."

 

[nuuumannn]

I had fun with that comment in Perth many decades ago.

The funny thing is when I lived in Australia, the majority of them had the driest senses of humour. Not much offends them. I like that about them.

 

[XBe02Drvr]

AFCM is a E-9 Master Chief that combined a few "rates" such as airframes, engines, hydraulics.

And an APCM is an obsolete rate, Aviation Pilot Chief (Master), which was actually abolished years ago, before E8 (Senior) and E9 (Master) Chief rates were established, by Macnamara, I think. The Navy seemed to humor the few old guys who were still active by letting them wear the insignia. (Probably to avoid suffering anal enlargement.)

 

[nuuumannn]

Great minds think alike.

When this covid stuff is over, you're all invited for a barbeque. Bring your bevvie of choice!

 

[jetcal1]

The funny thing is when I lived in Australia, the majority of them had the driest senses of humour. Not much offends them. I like that about them.

I hosted a group onboard my ship (1982) and there were numerous people in their 70's. Several of my inadvertent (And innocent) comments were offensive 'but not offending" to some of them. They understood I was young and not trying to be rude. (Just like I didn't get offended when they innocently teased me.)

 

[jetcal1]

And an APCM is an obsolete rate, Aviation Pilot Chief (Master), which was actually abolished years ago, before E8 (Senior) and E9 (Master) Chief rates were established, by Macnamara, I think. The Navy seemed to humor the few old guys who were still active by letting them wear the insignia. (Probably to avoid suffering anal enlargement.)

I seem to recall the last one retiring in the early 80's out of a VP outfit.

 

[Peter Gunn]

Man I take a couple of days off and you guys go hog wild in here.

WRT post Midway and the IJN, Shattered Sword has a good amount of detail about changes for IJN doctrine, they actually DID learn quite a bit but were slow at instituting it. There were changes that were supposed to be in place at the time of I think Eastern Solomons, but were delivered too late to the fleet to act on. They were literally trying to fly out to the carriers with new changes, read Shattered Sword for details.

Also during the Solomon's Campaign, the IJN was still in the game and gave as good as it got, perhaps better if you counter them losing one light carrier and zero fleet carriers vis a vis USN loss of Hornet and Wasp with Saratoga damaged and sent stateside (again). They just didn't have the ability to STAY in the game. Their building program hadn't foreseen the protracted type of war they found themselves not only mired in, but by virtue of the sneak attack on Pearl Harbor, virtually guaranteed they would be in. Mentioned in SS is the fact that the Japanese never understood the war they instigated, but also did not understand their opponent, and even their own goals for going to war with the United States in the first place could be said to be rather nebulous and short sighted.

Much like expecting the American's at Midway to "go lowing to their slaughter" (Shattered Sword) they totally misread the effect on the American psyche regarding the way they started the war. Seen as weak willed for starters I think that America's resolve to prosecute the war to the fullest extent was quite a shock to them, and indeed, I think many still didn't accept that they had their collective asses kicked from hell to breakfast, even in 1945.

They also apparently failed to take into account America's economy, which had been running in low gear due the Great Depression, but was still in 1940, FIVE TIMES that of Japan's, which was already straining due to their mucking about in China and Southeast Asia etc. So as their economy started reaching its breaking point in 1940-41, America's went from that low gear into overdrive.

But back to Midway, I can't take any credit for what I've written, just paraphrasing from Shattered Sword, which I believe is one of the most comprehensive books written on ANY battle in the history of warfare. There are others AS good, but none better I believe.

 

[SaparotRob]

I don't know why I keep forgetting about U.S.S. Saratoga.

 

[Peter Gunn]

I don't know why I keep forgetting about U.S.S. Saratoga.

Probably because she was in and out of the repair yards so many times in 1942 from torpedo hits. A pity really as she is my second favorite after Enterprise.

 

[SaparotRob]

Probably because she was in and out of the repair yards so many times in 1942 from torpedo hits. A pity really as she is my second favorite after Enterprise.

The Lexington class were pretty cool looking.