P-38H-1 and new superchargcher intake

Discussion in 'Aviation' started by Marcin, Feb 15, 2014.

  1. Marcin

    Marcin New Member

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    #1 Marcin, Feb 15, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 15, 2014
    Hi,
    I have a problem with Maj. Edward Cragg P-38H.
    It's very possible that aircraft at this photo is P-38H-1. Number partly obscured by "A" letter ends with "7". That points to factory number 42-66506 (undoubtly P-38H-1).
    Now comes the wierd part. As You can see at attached picture, supercharger intake seems to be in new, redesigned shape (like in P-38J/L). Most aviable sources claim, that new supercharger ver. B-33 was installed in P-38H-5 and newer.
    My question is: it is possible that P-38H-1 had new intake but old supercharger?
    Thanks in advance
    Marcin
     

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  2. tomo pauk

    tomo pauk Creator of Interesting Threads

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    'Vee's for victory' state that indeed all of the 226 P-38H-1s retained the B-13 turbocharger, same as fitted on P-38Gs. The engine-stage supercharger remained the same, though.
     
  3. Marcin

    Marcin New Member

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    It is clear that supercharger remain the same as on P-38G. But what about intake on the boom? Was it new one, or old?
     
  4. Shortround6

    Shortround6 Well-Known Member

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    I am not sure what you are refering to?

    P-38F

    993022249_7a68af7ec2_b.jpg

    Supercharger intake is the scoop just under the Flap, I believe there was an alternative air intake inside the landing gear compartment for taxiing/low level flying in dusty conditions?
     
  5. Marcin

    Marcin New Member

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    I'm refering to the scoop under wing. Compare my picture and Yours. Glacier Girl is P-38F with old type intake. Porky 2 is undoubtly P-38H-1 with old type B-13 supercharger/turbosupercharger, but when You take a closer look intake looks like new version, installed on P-38H-5, P-38J and so on... All these versions have new, boosted B-33 supercharger and reshaped scoop.
    I'm wondering is it possible that P-38H-1 with B-13 supercharger installed, could have that new scoop?
     
  6. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    I believe the P-38G and beyond used the new supercharger intake scoop.

    Today none of the flying P-38's uses the original turbosupercharger intake scoop. They are all closed off since none of the flying P-38's uses operating turbochargers. Instead, the center scoop in the front intake that used to feed the intercooler is the carburetor air intake and the two outer intakes also in the center intake feed the oil coolers, just like they did originally.

    In all the flying P-38's today, the turbo is retained for weight and balance and probably appearance, too, but they don't turn. They just serve as an exhaust outlet. If you think it is hard to find parts for an Allison, try finding parts for an 80 year old turbocharger! I know a few people who have a turbocharger that works (probably needs bearings ...), but I don't know of anyone who has two. The unit that Planes of Fame has is a cutaway and would never be able to be returned to operating condition.

    If someone really wanted to do so, he could probably pull together 3 - 4 turbochargers and get one of the P-38's running on turbos, but who wants to spend their very expensive warbird time flying straight and level in IFR airspace? I know there is one P-47 that is flyable in the USA that has a working turbocharger, but it is the only one I know of in an operating fighter from WWII. There might be another one or two around that have it but don't advertise the fact. One thing is for sure; if you HAVE a working turbocharger on an Allison setup, you'd best tell the guy who overhauls your Allison so he knows it before overhaul. I don't think we have the gasoline grades available at most FBO's today to run them at WWII boost levels way up high, but people try funny things.

    The tractor-pull guys in Europe running turbos usually blend their own fuel and are turning the Allisons at up to 4,600 rpm ... but not for long. A tractor pull doesn't last very long, so it really doesn't hurt the engine much. Also, the turbochargers they are using are not WWII units. Joe Yancey has one customer over there who has been running two or three of his Allisons in a turbo pulling tractor for 5+ years without any major damage!

    The turbochargers in the CAF's B-17 Sentimental Journey used to be operational back in the very early 1990's, but I don't know if they still use them today. Back then I was in Mesa, Arizona at Falcon Field one day when they were doing maintenance on one of the turbocharger wastegate motors. They are at the rear of the wing in the trailing edge and there is a hatch where you can see the motor or touch it with a hand, but you can't do both at the same time. You work on it by feel alone. They were lamenting the state of the waste gate motor amplifier and the weak tubes in it. I tried to find some replacement Russian tubes and did, but nobody wanted to take a chance at using them in their very rare B-17 waste gate amplifier. Too bad, the Russians made good tubes. Haven't checked lately ... maybe they still do.
     
  7. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    Here is an enlarged image of the area... methinks.

    turbicharger intake.jpg
     
  8. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    #8 GregP, Feb 17, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2014
    That looks the same as on a J or an L model.
     
  9. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    And this is the reason Marcin has asked about.
     
  10. Marcin

    Marcin New Member

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    This scoop is a real mistery. It will be great to have a documentation of P-38-H-1 with clear indication: new scoop or old scoop. But i'm asking too much...
    Yet another question. Does anyone know what are crew's members first names painted on that Edward Cragg's aircraft?
     
  11. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    In the Porky II scheme the pilot was Edward "Porky" Cragg.

    In spring 1942, he was reassigned to what was then designated the 80th Pursuit Squadron, part of the 8th Pursuit Group, Fifth Air Force in the Southwest Pacific area. Both the squadron and group were soon redesignated from "Pursuit" to "Fighter". Initially, the squadron flew P-39 Airacobras. Cragg named his "Porky", and soon acquired the nickname of "Porky". He was promoted to captain on December 17, 1942

    On April 8, 1943, he became the commander of the 80th. Among his first actions was giving the Squadron the name "The Headhunters" after the local New Guinean headhunter tribes who hated the Japanese and helped to rescue downed pilots. He also commissioned crewchief Yale Saffro, a former Walt Disney Studios artist, to design the 80th's patch, the likeness of the proud Papuan Chief of New Guinea. This original design can be seen "here".. Squadron lore credits him with arranging the equipping the squadron with the new P-38 Lightning aircraft. He named his "Porky II".

    In the 23 Skidoo scheme, the pilot was Captain Perry J. "Pee Wee" Dahl of the 432th Fighter Squadron, 475th Fighter Group.
     
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