Question about Lost in Combat

Discussion in 'Aviation' started by vikingBerserker, Nov 15, 2014.

  1. vikingBerserker

    vikingBerserker Well-Known Member

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    I have an odd question that has come up in conversations with several other people and I wanted to run it by you guys.

    If a military plane was destroyed on the ground during Pearl Harbor, would that aircraft be considered as having been lost or destroyed during combat?
     
  2. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    #2 GregP, Nov 15, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2014
    Lost in a ground attack.

    If it was utterly destroyed, yes.

    If it was repaired and flew again, maybe no. Maybe not if even parts were used to make another plane flyable.

    Its a crap shoot without the real, exact records.
     
  3. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    hard to say...

    If it was burnt to the ground then it was written off.

    It it damaged beyond repair, then it was cannibalized to repair the other aircraft that weren't as badly damaged.

    If it had superficial damage, then new parts or parts cannibalized from the hammered aircraft were used to get it airworthy again.

    If it suffered a bunch of holes and a such, then it was quickly repaired and was a non-issue...
     
  4. vikingBerserker

    vikingBerserker Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the replies gents, I perhaps did not word the question in the best way.

    What I should have said is if a plane is on the ground parked doing nothing and another plane came up and destroyed it, is the plane that was destroyed on the ground considered as having been lost in combat or was it merely destroyed
     
  5. drgondog

    drgondog Well-Known Member

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    I don't think a distinction is made. Destroyed/Written Off is a category E whether crashing at the end of the runway on take off or destroyed in a strafing attack. A subsequent Accident Report attached to serial number of the damaged/destroyed bird would be prepared but since I have never seen a report of say Pearl Harbor categorizing the losses.

    One example that comes to mind was an accident at Steeple Morden on January 1, 1945 when a B-17 from nearby 91st BG took off at Bassingbourn, had an engine failure and crashed on the 354FS flight line destroying or damaging six P-51's. Accident Report was written citing the damage and cause - but I have never seen a Form which addresses a 'lost in combat' other than a MACR and the daily report citing serial number and type for a/c lost - but I can't recall whether a combat vs Accident category was visible or checked off.
     
  6. Shortround6

    Shortround6 Well-Known Member

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    We have two different circumstances. Drgondog has given you a "friendly fire" accident, and there were a number of ground collisions not only between parked and taxiing aircraft but parked/taxiing aircraft and trucks/service equipment.

    IF the aircraft in questions was destroyed/damaged by enemy action, (strafing/bombing) then I would think it was destroyed in combat. Nobody says "combat" has to be fair :)

    And if you don't count aircraft destroyed on the ground as "in combat" What destroyed all those trucks/trains/wagons/barges in many theaters of war, Sunspots?

    Although there may not be official record keeping of exact "cause", from the historical perspective we might employ similar criteria to that used in awarding the Purple Heart. Was the loss the result of enemy action, not that the loss occurred in the vicinity of the enemy.
     
  7. vikingBerserker

    vikingBerserker Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Gents, I appreciate your input!
     
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