Searching for .........

[Erich]

well so much for the hype that went around here and the hero worship going on .......... geezo !

AN AUTOPSY SHOWS THAT JAMES KIM, THE SAN FRANCISCO MAN WHO DIED IN THE MOUNTAINS NEAR MERLIN, SUCCUMBED TO EXPOSURE AND HYPOTHERMIA.

THE AUTOPSY WAS CONDUCTED THURSDAY MORNING. OREGON STATE POLICE LIEUTENANT GREGG HASTINGS SAYS 35-YEAR-OLD JAMES KIM WAS FOUND, FULLY CLOTHED, ON HIS BACK IN THE BIG WINDY CREEK NEAR THE ROGUE RIVER. ( and he was nowhere even close to the river )

A SEARCH HELICOPTER HIRED BY THE KIM FAMILY SPOTTED KIM'S BODY AT MIDDAY YESTERDAY. IT WAS ABOUT A MILE FROM WHERE HE SET OUT TWO DAYS AFTER HIS WIFE AND TWO DAUGHTERS WERE RESCUED FROM THE VEHICLE, STUCK ON A REMOTE ROAD.

INVESTIGATORS BELIEVE HE TRAVELED ABOUT TEN MILES ON-FOOT.

KIM'S WIFE, KATI, AND THEIR DAUGHTERS FOUR-YEAR-OLD PENELOPE AND SEVEN MONTH-OLD SABINE WERE RESCUED MONDAY.

let's face it guys the guy screwed up, did not have the proper clothing to head out in the cold elements, was under hypothermia's delusions like we ALL said and walked in circles due to the proximity of his position to his car, 10 miles going nowhere.
again head down the frickin road you came up on. I almost shake my head in disbelief but I have seen this so many times in the mountains.

E ~

 

[Matt308]

Poor kids.

 

[Erich]

that is SO right, and poor wife ............ this whole thing was SO wrong and could of been prevented

 

[Matt308]

Erich, they said the wife and kids were in the car for 9 days. When did the dad leave the vehicle? On the ninth day? Haven't read anything.

 

[Erich]

it is not clear and they are not revealing everything .......... yet.

I thought the guy went out for 2-3 days and just walked in circles till he dropped over dead with no food/water intake

 

[Matt308]

Wow. Can't imagine that panic that must have set in when he realized he was never going to see his kids again.

 

[Erich]

I really think he wasn't at that point ............. he probably thought I have to do this to save my familie thinking he was heading down to the Rogue River and that someone would find him. He got hypothermic probably during the night, went off crazily like they all do not equipped clothing wise and set out for who knows, his mind drawing a blank, feeling nothing and doing nothing till he just wasted away bodily and mindly. this all is short term meaning it does not take hours and hours to effect you, getting cold at first, your mind shrugs that off, the body plays tricks by sending rhythmic impulses to the brain and nerves telling you to strip down as you are too warm, then the mind goes, indecision time, blank stares, open mouth slight gasping for air as the body starts to shut down, walking short distances thinking you are walking miles, energy levels drop off dramatically.

You just cannot walk around in a foot or more of snow even on a clear day with wind chill, wet jeans, tennis shoes and wet slightly frozen socks without this affecting you. James was doomed the moment he left his wife, kids and their car

 

[Matt308]

No. He realized it. At some point, he realized he was in over his head. Then comes the panic, the fast breathing, getting colder, the desperation...

Too convenient to think he just succumbed to the cold and never knew what hit him. Life's not that kind.

 

[Erich]

well Matt it happens on a repeated basis, I know this as fact pulling people out of the overdepth snow, some have a clue and know they are doomed, some not. you cannot tell by an autopsy as it will not reveal the indicators. The guy walked some 10 miles and was lost and I personally feel he flet he made the right choice and was going to be saved, the rough thing is the last 2 days of his ordeal was in thick fog, thus the dis-orientation until his mind drew a blank and he turned zombie

 

[Matt308]

Hellish. That's very Dante'-esque.

 

[lesofprimus]

Looks like he was in the car with the fam for 7 days, went walkabout, and his wife and kids were rescued 2 days later....

And Matt, I can confirm what Erich wrote about hypothermia.... During BUDs training, we were in 58 degree water for over 30 minutes, with everyone getting hypothermic before being pulled from the water.... Obviously, this was to teach us the dangers of it, and to recognize the signs....

At first the pain was severe, especially in the joints... Then ur joints start to lock up... I couldnt stand up once pulled from the water.... Then the pain subsided and a warmth came over me... Instructor Williams then told us what was happening.... When we tried to ask questions, there were 6 blubbering tadpoles sitting in a zodiac... I couldnt focus my eyes, was disorientated, and really didnt realize what was happening to my body till we started warming up...

Bottom line, the guy didnt know what happened to him... Once the pain and cold subside, unless u are warmed up, u go downhill very fast.... Atleast he didnt suffer, and probably died without knowing he was dying...

 

[Erich]

yep the last resort is you just fall asleep, we had several probs with guys on Mt. Hood and Shasta that sat out overnight with next to nothing on, they just stared at us, could not respond, one guy had frozen drool down the side of his chap ridden lips. we did our best to keep them awake and all they wanted to do was go to sleep. the guys were so cold but they felt nothing.
another concern was on two other occasions we had to pull people off big stone boulders where the cold actually intesified from the ground up through the rock into their butts. They sat huddled up on those things, and we had to literally bodily remove them from their spots.

pretty weird story about James, the guy took off and the so-called experts said he died Saturday while they rescued Katie and her 2 kiddos on Monday, they being out for at least 9 days............ we haven't heard the last word on this bizarre tragedy, I'm scratching my head as this doesn't make any sense

 

[pbfoot]

Seems to be the big story in the US media but I gotta look at the dark side of this and that thought is promotions for some at CNET

 

[Erich]

Idiots in media always play up "how to stay safe in winter" after a tragedy like this. That is what I have cued into on CNN, MSNBC, Fox and the local puke TV station news. Should of covered this at Octobers end to get ready for the snow, but I suppose the obvious is too easy .............

 

[Matt308]

Ouch. Well then perhaps life is more kind than I thought.

 

[lesofprimus]

Erich kinda hit the nail on the head.... The dangers of extreme outdoor conditions are pretty much unknown to the uninitiated and laymen....

"Oh, Im stranded, I better go hike through the woods and find help..."

The news is touting this guy as a hero.... I woulnt go that far, but would say that he did what he thought he had to do for his family.... But why wait 7 days before going to look for help??? Burning tires for warmth??? Burning rubber gives off toxic fumes... Fumes that Im sure his children enjoyed inhaling.... Guess they were too cold to go pick up sticks and logs to burn...

How about spending 3 days collecting all the wood u could find, make it into one of the worlds largest bonfires, torch it up and hope that someone from Fish and Wildlife/Forest Rangers sees the smoke produced and investigates...

7 days on a mountain pass with ur 2 young kids and wife sounds just plain dumb... How many miles can u guys walk on a road in one day???

20??? 30???

The road they got stranded on was only 15 miles from the main road... He could have made that in under 8 hours, flageed down a logger or trucker, and saved himself and remained a father for his now fatherless children...

Once again, Mother Nature proves that the uneducated lose... Still a shame tho, but spare me with the hero bullsh!t...

 

[evangilder]

Well said. In a situation like that it is best to stay with the vehicle, as that is the biggest thing that anyone searching for you can find. And like you said, Dan, build a big-ass bonfire. That will surely get some attention. Break off the rear view mirror and use it to signal any aircraft overhead. Being prepared is the key too. I obviously don't normally drive in snow, but through the desert is not unusual in the summer. I always carry at least 10 gallons of water when trekking through the desert with the family, along with other things, just in case.