Ad: This forum contains affiliate links to products on Amazon and eBay. More information in Terms and rules
While those are both worth while priorities, it doesn't answer the question of what do you do with with planes that are pouring of the production lines at the rate of several hundred per month that are not suitable for a strategic bombing campaign.
Stopping production of Merlin IIIs and Xs while waiting for the Merlin XX series to show up isn't really an option either.
So what can you use these planes for that could hurt the Germans (and/or hold down British losses, including Army and Navy) while the better bombers and modern fighters are developed and put into production.
Lets face it, you can only use so many target tugs.
Use it on the French?Well, yes and no.
The Imperial Romans had "Greek Fire" which was handy for naval warfare.
Otherwise, actual Napalm wasn't developed until 1942, so can't use it on the French any earlier...
What is the net gain?Is air to air refueling an option? You might "lose" 1/2 to 1/3 of your bombing force to tankers, but it would get you the ability to bomb Berlin.
I approve.One RAF Officer to another
" well, Nigel, we have bombed Berlin 5 times in the last two weeks but we have lost 60% of our bombers, we can't continue"
Nigel replies
" True enough Algernon, but at least we didn't have to support the bloody army !"
Initial gain - you can bomb Berlin with the aircraft you have. Maybe not safely or accurately, but it puts Luftwaffe on defensive.What is the net gain?
And in What year.
One RAF Officer to another
" well, Nigel, we have bombed Berlin 5 times in the last two weeks but we have lost 60% of our bombers, we can't continue"
Nigel replies
" True enough Algernon, but at least we didn't have to support the bloody army !"
Initial gain - you can bomb Berlin with the aircraft you have. Maybe not safely or accurately, but it puts Luftwaffe on defensive.
Longer term, once you have the technology refined, your bombers can be much smaller as they aren't carrying thousands of gallons of fuel to get to target, so can be smaller - smaller = faster = reduced ability for enemy forces to engage = lower defensive requirement = smaller.
Given the thread gave a Sept '38 start point, I'm be giving the RAE engineers 1 calendar year to have the 1st tanker/bomber group functional. That date coinciding with the German invasion of Poland is a happy coincidence.
he RAF lied about what it could do and was caught, somewhat, by the Munich Crisis.
Both Belgium and Holland were neutral and BC would have to fly around, not over them. Result of this was that neither the Battle or Blenheim I, BC's most numerous bombers in 1938 and 1939, could reach the Ruhr and return.
Other countries with short ranged aircraft used them in support of their army and navy, or used limited numbers of slow long range planes in support of the navy. The RAF simply doubled down and said "not our job/s" and continued the long range bombers plan while sucking up a large part of the defense budget.
Correct. Virtually all European air forces followed in Douhet's wake. His influence was enormous and the Germans, in particular subscribed to his idea of bombers wreaking havoc on civilian populations to bring them to the negotiating table and it almost appeared that it worked for them in 1939 and early 1940, but Douhet also missed the point of combined operations between forces and tactical innovation, which was the secret to German success in those periods and both of which Douhet studiously ignores.The only goal was a Douhet style strategic bombing campaign! What other possible goal was there!
Pricy but if you really want to know the full story of how RAF requirements were set this book is it.
Of course, used in this manner they'd probably pay a butcher's-bill, but the Hampdens could carry torps, right? Wellington as well?
One take away is that you dont want to be in any armed forces when a major war starts. Acting as a trip wire is not conducive to longevity .
Only specially converted ones. Not every Wellington nor every Hampden.
The problem I have with SR's perspective is that he assumes that British early war bombers are obsolete because of the experiences they went through and because of what came later. As has been said elsewhere, the Whitley and Wellington were among the best bombers in the world on their unveiling before the war. They had larger total bombloads than most bombers at the time, could carry them across greater distances than most other bombers at the time and evolved to have better defensive armament than all other bombers at the time. When the Wellingtons and Whitleys had power turrets in their noses and sterns, which other country had bombers with power turrets? None! The first US bombers with power-operated turrets had British ones.
Grant, just a quick note, here.The first US bombers with power-operated turrets had British ones.
Perhaps the British situation is different because the RAF was independent.The problem I have with this is that your picking on Britain is a bit disingenuous and obviously loaded with expectation when almost every armed force in every country in the Western world at the time was doing exactly the same thing and had been for years. Regarding the other countries operating jointly with the other branches of the services, that's an exaggeration and is wholly untrue. In peacetime between the wars, very few countries' services were working together, most were squabbling for funding for their own pet projects, the Japanese armed forces were the extreme example of this.
As it's been pointed out elsewhere, no one else could have attempted what Britain had to undergo in 1939 through 1941 with its bomber force without searching results that were less than inspiring, as Bomber Command's experiences were. We tend to forget that the USAAC promoted unescorted daylight bombing raids while the RAF had turned to night bombing as an expeditious means of continuing the bombing offensive because of operational experience, not to mention the sheer hopelessness of the first experiments using B-17s in combat in British hands in 1941.
A lot of people who ignored the lessons of WW I. That didn't require hindsight.I'm always gonna come out swinging in debates like this because they are loaded with the hindsight of knowing how the war turned out. Yes, the Brits made lots of mistakes in strategy before the war, but who didn't?
Well, that means no invasion of Russia. It is about 1500 miles from Brest (the one just over the border from Poland ) to Chelyabinsk.I mean, whose stupid idea was it to invade the USSR and not have a bomber that can reach the Urals?
It is about 1500 miles from Brest (the one just over the border from Poland ) to Chelyabinsk.
A lot of people who ignored the lessons of WW I. That didn't require hindsight.