Spitfire and P-38 (?) Captured, based at which German airfield?

[B-17engineer]

Hi guys, reading my book

JG 301/302 Wilde Sau I saw this picture. Its a Spitfire and what appears to be a P-38 in the background, the caption or tezt doesn't state where they are. Does anyone have info?

 

[Airframes]

Looks like they are both part of 'Zirkus Rosarius' H. The unit travelled around, demonstrating captured aircraft to the JGs and KGs, and doing comparison flights etc. So, the pic could be anywhere - unless someone has the same pics in another publication, with a caption stating exactly where.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I believe a lot of captured aircraft ended up in Echterdingen near Stuttgart. I am not sure of this however.

 

[B-17engineer]

I'm wondering since the book is about JG 301/302 if they were displaying them at one of their airfields at the time?

Thanks for the input guys

 

[Airframes]

I think Chris is right, Echterdingen was, I believe, their main base, and a testing / research centre, from where they toured. Very possibly could be taken at one of the JG 301 / 302 airfields though. The problem with some of these pics is that they are 'stock' shots, used just to illustrate the aircraft concerned, and the location might not be known.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

The aircraft actually belong to KG 200. I have the same pictures in my KG 200 book.

I am pretty sure that Echterdingen was at least one of the main bases for these aircraft. My father used to fly Hueys out of Echterdingen back in the 90s.

 

[Airframes]

Heck, I forgot I have the KG200 book, by P.W. Stahl. The answer might be in there somewhere, but it's so many years since I looked at it I'd have to read through it again.

 

[B-17engineer]

Thanks guys! I was thinking, oh a spitfire captured that's prety normal and I saw the P38 and thought it was pretty cool.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Heck, I forgot I have the KG200 book, by P.W. Stahl. The answer might be in there somewhere, but it's so many years since I looked at it I'd have to read through it again.

I have the same book. I will give it a look too.

 

[antoni]

There was more than one.

 

[Snautzer01]

Supermarine Spitfire PR.XI coded T9+BB

 

[FLYBOYJ]

I'd like to know where the author of the book where the 3rd photo from the top is shown (The machine here was probably delivered by a defector in northern Italy) can make that kind of assumption.

 

[B-17engineer]

I did some research and it says that was taken at Stendal...

 

[Airframes]

Joe, when I saw that caption, my immediate reaction was 'How can you state that?!'
Maybe if there is some vague shred of a hint of defection, the caption should have read possibly, not probably, but it strikes me as highly unlikely anyway.

 

[B-17engineer]

I know there was a P-38 delievered by an American Nazi Sympathizer. He was enlisted in the USAAF and flew a P-38 back to Italy...

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Joe, when I saw that caption, my immediate reaction was 'How can you state that?!'
Maybe if there is some vague shred of a hint of defection, the caption should have read possibly, not probably, but it strikes me as highly unlikely anyway.

Agree;

I think we would all have known many years ago about any US pilot defecting with an intact aircraft!

 

[B-17engineer]

Joe, I don't know how accurate this is but


"When it was a German piloted Allied aircraft trying to sneak in to shoot other planes down with kinetic energy (KE) bullets and small high explosive cannon shells that didn't produce the right radio response it was immediately shot down or forced away. The classic example of this False Flag Cat vs. Mouse game was the dual between an American YB-40 (B-17 gunship) bomber pilot versus an Italian pilot in a captured P-38 fighter. And YES, we had American Nazi traitors like USAAF LT. Martin Monti who stole a P-38."

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Joe, I don't know how accurate this is but


"When it was a German piloted Allied aircraft trying to sneak in to shoot other planes down with kinetic energy (KE) bullets and small high explosive cannon shells that didn't produce the right radio response it was immediately shot down or forced away. The classic example of this False Flag Cat vs. Mouse game was the dual between an American YB-40 (B-17 gunship) bomber pilot versus an Italian pilot in a captured P-38 fighter. And YES, we had American Nazi traitors like USAAF LT. Martin Monti who stole a P-38."

FALSE!

That story was fabricated by Martin Cadin in the book "The Forked Tailed Devil." YB-40s were NEVER used anywhere close to Italy and their combat career is well documented.

 

[B-17engineer]

Thanks for that bit of info, did he fabricate it on purpose or was he given bad information?

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Thanks for that bit of info, did he fabricate it on purpose or was he given bad information?

Cadin was a very entertaining writer. He might have taken a myth and just expanded it to sell his book never realizing how computers can now link information together in seconds where in his day it would take weeks or even months to research. Many people took stuff like this at face value 30 and 40 years ago.