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- #81
Admiral Beez
Major
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The coming $26 billion windfall for the Canadian Armed Forces. What to buy?
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Thumpalumpacus
Lieutenant Colonel
Right, but the F-20 could not carry as much ordnance as the -16, and had a range of 300-500 miles depending on mission ... not very good for a country as big as Canada.
But they're cheap and with lots of them they can still provide the needed airpower. Also we have to consider improvements in engines, weapons and avionics in the last decades to boost range vs payload.
Warspite63
Senior Airman
- 657
- Dec 8, 2022
Unfortunately, there's a rather large assumption in there......I think we should go through with the full F-35 purchase and any other projects underway or contracted. There's less than 211 weeks until Trump's gone, the last of Canada's F-35 probably won't be delivered until afterwards. It's a thirty plus year commitment, POTUS47 through 50 will be long gone.
Planned Canadian Forces projects - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
But for future projects we should avoid US firms unless we have no better options.
Thumpalumpacus
Lieutenant Colonel
With a lot of airbases, perhaps. But the thing is, airframes are not infinitely upgradable. And not only does the airframe have limits, so too does any firmware architecture. You have to upgrade them to modern standards, to interface with the vastly improved firmware, why not just buy a modern plane?
A Tigershark was great for its day, but it's an also-ran in today's air environment.
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- #86
Admiral Beez
Major
I always thought the Panavia Tornado ADV would have been the ideal long distance interceptor for Canada's NORAD mission to replace the CF-101s operating from CFB Comox (British Columbia) and CFB Bagotville (Quebec), while the IDS could meet our NATO strike role then undertaken by the CF-104s out of CFB Söllingen (Germany). Canada was an early partner in the Tornado program. That was a good opportunity to put the US military industrial complex at arms length. Looks great in the snow too.
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- #88
Admiral Beez
Major
Looks good. We could also get some Black Panther tanks.
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- #90
Admiral Beez
Major
Of course we then open ourselves up to being cut off by France, as Israel discovered. In their case Israel knocked off the Dassault Mirage and made the Kfir.
Thumpalumpacus
Lieutenant Colonel
... which is really the issue in a country without indigenous arms development and supply.
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- #92
Admiral Beez
Major
Agreed. Canada's 40 million souls have the 9th largest global GDP, higher than South Korea, Russia or Brazil, countries with strong indigenous arms supplies. Heck, the Brazilians are making their own nuclear attack boats, with French help. If we wanted indigenous arms development and supply, we'd have it.
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- #93
Admiral Beez
Major
Dassault Aviation Offers Rafale to Portugal, Canada as Alternatives to F-35
Last week, French president advocated for European-made military systems to replace American products
Looks like Canada is leaning towards a dual fighter force. Britain's Royal Air Force has about forty F-35Bs (co-shared with the Fleet Air Arm) and about 135 Eurofighter Typhoons. If the Brits can operate two disparate fighter types, so can we. Eurofighter is still in production, what about those over the Rafale? We could spin it into a discussion on an expanded CETA.
Quick comparison between F-35 alternates:Dassault Aviation Offers Rafale to Portugal, Canada as Alternatives to F-35
Last week, French president advocated for European-made military systems to replace American productswww.defensemirror.com
Looks like Canada is leaning towards a dual fighter force. Britain's Royal Air Force has about forty F-35Bs (co-shared with the Fleet Air Arm) and about 135 Eurofighter Typhoons. If the Brits can operate two disparate fighter types, so can we. Eurofighter is still in production, what about those over the Rafale? We could spin it into a discussion on an expanded CETA.
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- #96
Admiral Beez
Major
That's only a problem if the US declares that somehow NATO-founding member Canada, where nearly all RCAF aircraft are thus equipped, cannot have access to US engines through SAAB. To do so would further enrage and motivate Canada, Europe and others to further decouple their military procurement from the US.
Notwithstanding France's desire for technological independence, the Rafale also relies on US tech. Has Washington ever blocked a Rafale sale?
How French is the Rafale? Huge American Inputs Needed to Make it Work
The French Rafale represents one of five fourth generation fighters developed in Europe, and since its entry into service in 2001 has increasingly formed the backbone of
militarywatchmagazine.com
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- #98
Admiral Beez
Major
You do what you can, when you can.
Which may, or may not, have been used to get rid of the Gripen in favor of F-16 for Colombia. Saab denies US veto on sale of Gripen fighter jet to Colombia - Air Data News
Whether that allegation is true or not, I'm sure non-US West-aligned weapons manufacturers are hotly looking at going "ITAR-free" as much as possible.
Or if Canada doesn't wish to be seen buying American.
