TU-16 Badger vs B-47 Statojet vs Avro Vulcan?

[Lucky13]

Which of these three was the better design?

 

[plan_D]

I'd say the Avro Vulcan was the better aircraft, but the better design goes to the B-47 due to the fact that the essential look of the Stratojet became the B-52 - which has been the premier strategic bomber since 1959.

 

[pbfoot]

I think the Tu 16 has to be the winner with it's longevity in service of over 50years followed by the B47 for the reasons stated by Plan D with the Vulcan trailing as it was not in squadron service 5 years later then the Badger or 47

 

[Matt308]

I'd vote for the Vulcan if we are talking cold war nuclear delivery. Radar signature is lower, handling is supposedly better and modernization kept it as a front line bomber than the other two which were relegated to secondary reonnaissance and anti-shipping roles.

Again it boils down to what mission are you prescribing.

 

[magnocain]

I vote for the Vulcan.

 

[Matt308]

Well. That was convincing.

 

[Glider]

My head says the Vulcan for a number of reasons, but as a lad I always liked the B47, probably the sleekest looking heavy bomber ever.

 

[HealzDevo]

I say, the Vulcan is the best potential stealth bomber of its time. Probably could have done the other roles if available in enough numbers, and modified to perform them.

 

[davparlr]

I'll go by date of introduction

The B-47 was the most historically significant since it led to the B-52 and KC-135/Boeing 707. Its design and performance was revolutionary and it was certainly a problem for the USSR. Their heroics buzzing Russian Mig bases and scooting off before the Migs could catch them is quite a story. Some came back with 20mm holes in them.

The Tu-16 was probably a typical under performing Russian jet bomber which was a success in the USSR but would probably never made it in a Western AF. It became a core for the Tu-104, a commercial jet.

The Vulcan was probably the most modern, flying five years after the B-47, capable, and effective of the three. I actually saw one of these at a airshow once. Amazing aircraft. And, made it into a Bond movie.8)

 

[The Basket]

The Tu-16 was exported and is still flown and developed in China.

The B-47...when it made its incursions...flew against MiG-15 and 17. It would have been in trouble against a MiG-19. A Farmer did shoot down an Elint 47 killing some of the crew. The Soviets did not use 20mm cannon on early MiGs.

 

[vikingBerserker]

I'll go with the Vulcan, which I believe was the last of the 3 used in actual combat.

 

[davparlr]

The Tu-16 was exported and is still flown and developed in China.

and still would not have been bought by a Western AF

The B-47...when it made its incursions...flew against MiG-15 and 17. It would have been in trouble against a MiG-19. A Farmer did shoot down an Elint 47 killing some of the crew.

So, exactly what aircraft were the Russians flying when the B-47 entered service in 1951? When did the Mig-19 enter service, 1955? Can you imagine if they had tried that in 1959 against the Mig-21? Certainly from 1951 until the Mig-19 was deployed in force post 1955, the B-47 was a major headache for the Russians.

The Soviets did not use 20mm cannon on early MiGs.

Sorry, I should have said 23 mm.

 

[Matt308]

So, exactly what aircraft were the Russians flying when the B-47 entered service in 1951? .

MiG-15. And more than a few were shot down as RB-47s during the cold war. You want a fan-effing-tastic read about RB-47s, RB-29s, RB-50s, RC-130s, US subs doing covert ops tapping Russian comm cables, etc., buy Blind Man's Bluff. You will not be disappointed. And you will be shocked by the number of US air assets shot down that you never have heard about. It was a war. And many of our best lost their lives fighting it.

 

[Glider]

Ordered, one Blind Mans Bluff. Thanks for the tip

 

[herman1rg]

Maybe someone could add a poll to this thread?

 

[davparlr]

MiG-15. And more than a few were shot down as RB-47s during the cold war. You want a fan-effing-tastic read about RB-47s, RB-29s, RB-50s, RC-130s, US subs doing covert ops tapping Russian comm cables, etc., buy Blind Man's Bluff. You will not be disappointed. And you will be shocked by the number of US air assets shot down that you never have heard about. It was a war. And many of our best lost their lives fighting it.

I heartily second this recommendation. It is absolutely fascinating! Better than any spy novel.

If we had those guys around, and I am not sure we don't, there would be a North Korean sub lying in pieces on the bottom somewhere in the Yellow Sea.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Here's a photo of my Uncle Bill I've posted on here before, I believe taken at Barksdale AFB just after the Korean War. The aircraft is a B-50. He told me that they were deploying to Japan when this was taken to replace a crew that was already deployed there. He later found out that crew and aircraft were lost over Vladivostok.

I had a long conversation about ferret missions with my uncle the last time I saw him alive. He revealed to me that he participated in such mission through out the 1950s. There was a secret and covert war going on at this time and many times there were "shootouts" on both sides.

 

[steve51]

Hello,

According to 'By Any Means Necessary' by William Burrows, two RB-47 aircraft were shot down by Soviet fighters. One on April 17, 1955 by a Mig 15 and another on July 1, 1960 by a Mig 19. The Mig 19 pilot is identified by name. Burrows lists 16 shoot downs of American aircraft between 1950 and 1969. It's a shame that the courage of these recon crews isn't better known.

 

[herman1rg]

Thanks to whoever added the poll, I've voted

 

[Wingspanner]

I once had the pleasure of meeting Walter Boyne - he was a mine of info on the B47 which he insisted was one of the most consistently under-rated aircraft of the period. I've voted Vulcan on the poll based on overall performance and adaptability - but its a close run thing, given that the '47 was in service earlier.