What if Germany had access to large Nickel reserves in WWII?

Grant Barr · Feb 28, 2022

I have, for some time, wondered what the outcome of WWII would have been if Germany had access to an adequate supply of nickel. Whilst I am no historical expert, I have come across a lot of references that a shortage of many key raw materials, but most notably nickel, placed a significant limitation on the ability of Germany to produce high quality metals for use in all their military equipment.

This thought has just recently been reinforced having read about the issues with engine materials in the book The Secret Horsepower Race (Callum Douglas). This is just one example, I know aero-engines were not the only area suffering huge issues as a result of limited nickel reserves. It's certainly interesting to extrapolate on what it could have looked like - just fighter performance alone could have been very different!

Thumpalumpacus · Feb 28, 2022

It would've affected the quality of their armor as well, I think. Nickel adds elasticity to an alloy.

Grant Barr · Feb 28, 2022

What little I know of metallurgy suggests that nickel can have a significant impact on the properties of any base metal it is alloyed with. A tweak here and there seems to produce some real changes - valves in high performance engines comes immediately to mind, but I do remember reading somewhere that nickel does assist in armour impact resistance.

GrauGeist · Feb 28, 2022

Nickel and chromium for their jet engines would have made a considerable difference.

And yes, nickel for amour, gun barrels and more.

The U.S. was in short supply of nickel at one point, which caused the U.S. mint to strike nickels (five cent coins) out of silver during the war.

tomo pauk · Mar 1, 2022

Grant Barr said:
What little I know of metallurgy suggests that nickel can have a significant impact on the properties of any base metal it is alloyed with. A tweak here and there seems to produce some real changes - valves in high performance engines comes immediately to mind, but I do remember reading somewhere that nickel does assist in armour impact resistance.

Having enough of nickel will mean less problems for the BMW 801 and DB 605.
(Un)fortunately, ample supply of nickel cannot reverse the effects of the flaws of the German high startegy, like the attack on the Soviet Union before there is some kind of peace with the UK.

33k in the air · Mar 1, 2022

The biggest thing Germany lacked was oil.

Tkdog · Mar 1, 2022

Increase nickel and for some production chains the limiting reagent becomes something else. Likely energy and people in some cases.

Grant Barr · Mar 1, 2022

Agree that Germany lacked a great many resources, but I was thinking about what would have been different if just one resource, in this case nickel, was more abundant.

Other resources would most definitely become a limiting factor, but if just this one item was not an issue then what is the impact on Germany's ability to pursue its military objectives?

Using just the engine valves (and other components) example - fighter performance would have been significantly better with both the DB and BMW engines performing as they were designed to. This could then have numerous flow on effects (not an exhaustive list by any measure):

Pressure on German synthetic fuel development, storage and distribution.
Improved air combat outcomes as a result of being able to utilise full engine power when required.
Pressure on Allied fighter performance - developments of the Merlin 61, Sabre, Griffon etc would have been under significantly more pressure. Where would the cracks appear in Allied engine development?
Would an improvement in German air combat performance on its own be sufficient to change key outcomes in the war?
Improvements in development time - less time spent looking for novel methods of substituting nickel in key components and more time developing the engines themselves, leading to faster development times. Think of the time spent developing the DB605 or the Jumo 213 for example.
Would more nickel have any substantive impact on the lack of focus for engine development in Germany? Probably not?

I'm sure the same could be said for improvements in metal alloys for tanks, guns, ships and any combat asset. Just changing this one resource parameter lends itself to a fascinating extrapolation of so many possibilities. I don't think any clear cut answers exist, but it's fun to think about it.

Admiral Beez · Mar 2, 2022

Thumpalumpacus said:
It would've affected the quality of their armor as well, I think. Nickel adds elasticity to an alloy.

Indeed. German armour would crack instead of bend to AP impacts.

Meanwhile, this KV took many shots without penetration. The spalling inside must have been something else though.

Ensign’s Q&A #20 Special Edition | For the Record

45South · Mar 5, 2022

Tkdog said:
Increase nickel and for some production chains the limiting reagent becomes something else. Likely energy and people in some cases.

33k in the air said:
The biggest thing Germany lacked was oil.

The resources used to make synthetic fuel were huge. 5 to 7 tons of oil to make 1 ton of fuel.

tomo pauk · Mar 5, 2022

Grant Barr said:
Using just the engine valves (and other components) example - fighter performance would have been significantly better with both the DB and BMW engines performing as they were designed to. This could then have numerous flow on effects (not an exhaustive list by any measure):

Pressure on German synthetic fuel development, storage and distribution.

Improved air combat outcomes as a result of being able to utilise full engine power when required.

Pressure on Allied fighter performance - developments of the Merlin 61, Sabre, Griffon etc would have been under significantly more pressure. Where would the cracks appear in Allied engine development?

Would an improvement in German air combat performance on its own be sufficient to change key outcomes in the war?

Improvements in development time - less time spent looking for novel methods of substituting nickel in key components and more time developing the engines themselves, leading to faster development times. Think of the time spent developing the DB605 or the Jumo 213 for example.

Would more nickel have any substantive impact on the lack of focus for engine development in Germany? Probably not?

1. German fuel infrastructure is already under severe pressure, unable to meet needs of the European Axis.
2. LW can best hope for slightly better outcomes of air combat - too much in the greater scheme of things.
3. There will be no cracks in Allied engine development.
4. No.
5. Germany lost the war by late 1941. They don't have the manpower, fuel, money (gold) and industrial capacity to change the outcome of the war.
6. Indeed not.

Jagdflieger · Mar 23, 2022

Germany besides crazy and lunatic ideas from its top leadership, lacked everything - not just nickel
The most important metal might have been tungsten - since it is a primary mineral (aside from ammunition) that essentially grantees high quality
machine tooling equipment - as such a decisive factor in regards to quality on any machined part.
But even if it would have made certain products far better, Germany's industrial layout and capacity/ability was never in a position to win that war.
It might have prolonged the ordeal for a couple of month - which would have really been bad, in view of the USA building something very special at
Los Alamos, designed and intendet for use onto Nazi-Germany.

Regards
Jagdflieger

Peter Gunn · Mar 23, 2022

I'm not sure more nickel would matter much, I agree with

tomo pauk Germany lost by late '41. They might have prolonged the war a bit but in the end, we all need to remember (whether we like it or not) what's waiting at the end of the nightmarish tunnel of World War II:

Peter Gunn · Mar 23, 2022

GrauGeist said:
Nickel and chromium for their jet engines would have made a considerable difference.

And yes, nickel for amour, gun barrels and more.

The U.S. was in short supply of nickel at one point, which caused the U.S. mint to strike nickels (five cent coins) out of silver during the war.

Don't forget the 1943 steel penny! I have several, they are pretty cool.

Jagdflieger · Mar 23, 2022

Hi there Peter Gunn,

darn it, I was actually looking for that kind of photo as an alternative to a written opinion

Regards
Jagdflieger

Peter Gunn · Mar 23, 2022

Hi J Jagdflieger

Welcome to the forum.

Jagdflieger · Mar 23, 2022

Hi there Peter Gunn

thanks for the friendly welcome - I am German so ..... in regards to that photo

Regards
Jagdflieger

tomo pauk · Mar 23, 2022

Jagdflieger said:
Germany besides crazy and lunatic ideas from its top leadership, lacked everything - not just nickel
The most important metal might have been tungsten - since it is a primary mineral (aside from ammunition) that essentially grantees high quality
machine tooling equipment - as such a decisive factor in regards to quality on any machined part.
But even if it would have made certain products far better, Germany's industrial layout and capacity/ability was never in a position to win that war.
It might have prolonged the ordeal for a couple of month - which would have really been bad, in view of the USA building something very special at
Los Alamos, designed and intendet for use onto Nazi-Germany.

Regards
Jagdflieger

Nazi Germany have had such a surplus of machine tools that they lacked both workforce to operate them, and the raw material too. Rubber, copper, nickel, silver... Then the severe lack of oil and lack of manpower for the needs of military and agriculture.

GrauGeist · Mar 23, 2022

Peter Gunn said:
Don't forget the 1943 steel penny! I have several, they are pretty cool.

And keep an eye of for pennies struck in 1944, 1945 and 1946 - those were made from shell casings.
The mint returned to copper pennies in 1947.

Jagdflieger · Mar 23, 2022

tomo pauk said:
Nazi Germany have had such a surplus of machine tools that they lacked both workforce to operate them, and the raw material too. Rubber, copper, nickel, silver... Then the severe lack of oil and lack of manpower for the needs of military and agriculture.

Hi tomo pauk,

If Germany had such a surplus of machine tools - I honestly wouldn't know, but that would not be the issue.
After Hitler had cut of the German industry from its main supplier of tungsten (China) in 1938/9 a steady decline in the quality output by its machine tooling industry
(which needs Wolframcarbid/Tungsten) became obvious by 1941 - e.g. very disastrous effects on valves and high tolerance parts for its jet-engine manufacturers and as such
actually rendering its Me 262 fleet on behalf of its jet-engines as vastly useless. That a lack in skilled manpower or forced labor made it even worse is undeniable.

Regards
Jagdflieger

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