What is a TF-51H?

[Sabrejet]

On another website, a discussion arose regarding two-seat P-51s and one poster said they weren't aware of a training version of the P-51H (F-51H). However it rang a bell and perusal of individual record cards confirmed that there was indeed a "TP-51H" designation (later, TF-51H). In fact quite a few of them.

My assumption is that the designation refers to a (flight) training version, rather than being a two-seater.

But does anyone know what the designation corresponded to in configuration terms?

 

[mjfur]

That's the first time I've ever seen or heard of that combo referenced.

 

[GreenKnight121]

Converted to TF-51H by removal of armament and gunsight. Assigned to the 3625th Pilot Training Wing at Tyndall until its replacement by T-33s in 1953-54. - Photo taken at Panama City - Tyndall AFB (PAM / KPAM) in Florida, USA in November, 1952.

44-64460/64714 North American P-51H-10-NA Mustang MSN 126-37886/38140.

64672 assigned to 159th Fighter Bomber Squadron Augmented (159th FBSA), Florida ANG
64683 assigned to 159th Fighter Bomber Squadron Augmented (159th FBSA), Florida ANG

 

[Sabrejet]

Nice one: from what I can see there must have been 80 or so TF-51H/TP-51H, converted between 1947 and 1951 (ish).

 

[GreenKnight121]

Looks like they were most likely used for flying proficiency and tactics training in order to save wear & tear on combat-coded F-51s and jet fighters.

 

[Sabrejet]

Some strange assignments coming up: several to Andrews AAF/AFB, which were possibly there so that Pentagon-assigned personnel could stay current ((IRC this was later the case with T-33s assigned to Andrews). It's a whole area I was previously unaware of.

 

[BiffF15]

View attachment 747162

44-64460/64714 North American P-51H-10-NA Mustang MSN 126-37886/38140.

64672 assigned to 159th Fighter Bomber Squadron Augmented (159th FBSA), Florida ANG
64683 assigned to 159th Fighter Bomber Squadron Augmented (159th FBSA), Florida ANG

Nice shots. I flew with the 325th FW / 1st FS for F-15 school, then later flew with the 159th FS in Jacksonville, FL (FANG).

 

[drgondog]

Some strange assignments coming up: several to Andrews AAF/AFB, which were possibly there so that Pentagon-assigned personnel could stay current ((IRC this was later the case with T-33s assigned to Andrews). It's a whole area I was previously unaware of.

Andrews and Bolling were bases from which Pentagon personnel gathered their monthly time. When my father was 'incarcerated' in Planning & Requirements for 3 years, he flew a variety of ships in 56-58, incl. B-26 (Douglas), T-33, F-86D, B-25, C-47, RB-57 and two trips in F-100 in his logbook.

 

[SaparotRob]

Andrews and Bolling were bases from which Pentagon personnel gathered their monthly time. When my father was 'incarcerated' in Planning & Requirements for 3 years, he flew a variety of ships in 56-58, incl. B-26 (Douglas), T-33, F-86D, B-25, C-47, RB-57 and two trips in F-100 in his logbook.

Did he comment on which planes he loved flying, tolerated flying or hated flying?

 

[Snautzer01]

Did he comment on which planes he loved flying, tolerated flying or hated flying?

What above said.

 

[drgondog]

Did he comment on which planes he loved flying, tolerated flying or hated flying?

Offhand the only airplane I heard a negative comment about was the Bf 109G-12(?) two seat version at Gablingen. He basic observation was that it was the worst vision of any aircraft - ever - for him. He flew about 70 different types and rated in 30. He never flew any of the Navy ships but flew every fighter in US inventory from P-38/39/40/47/51/61/63/ through F-80/82/84/86/86D/89/94 through F-100&105 plus Bf109G-6/12, FW 190A-8 and D-9.

A-20, B-25, B-26, A/B-26, plus SA-16, B-17, B-29, B-47, B-57, T-6, T-28, T-33, T-37, T-38.

SA-16, C-46, B-17, B-29 & B-47 as co-pilot.

All the BT's, C-45, C-46 and C-47

F-86E was his favorite, Bf 109 least favorite. P-51B/D before Reverse Rudder Boost and F-105 were close seconds to the F-86

5500 hours PIC

EDIT - he was not fond of the C-46 citing displeasure at smelling gas fumes all the time.

 

[SaparotRob]

I'm surprised at the F-105. I've heard the nicknames "Lead Sled" or "Thud" which doesn't imply pleasant flight characteristics.

 

[drgondog]

I'm surprised at the F-105. I've heard the nicknames "Lead Sled" or "Thud" which doesn't imply pleasant flight characteristics.

I have never heard a bad word about F-105 flight characteristics from a 105 pilot. With very high wing loading you flew the airplane fast but the ride was superb. Just don't try turning with a Mig. Only the F-111 (with 2 big engines) could outrun it (marginally). The later F-15 and even the F-4 could out run at altitude (marginally).

 

[BiffF15]

I have never heard a bad word about F-105 flight characteristics from a 105 pilot. With very high wing loading you flew the airplane fast but the ride was superb. Just don't try turning with a Mig. Only the F-111 (with 2 big engines) could outrun it (marginally). The later F-15 and even the F-4 could out run at altitude (marginally).

Quite the list, I'm envious! And I've heard that the Thud was fast, but very smooth. The Eagle would pummel you at low altitude high speed, especially over the Nevada desert.

 

[Tom Fey]

Thanks for this. Learning new things all the time.