What plane do you wish had sawservice
- Thread starter Mosin
- Start date
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kool kitty89
Senior Master Sergeant
Adler, why'd you say the P-83? It had good range and decent speed, but at that size it would be an ineffective fighter. Maby good for long range recon though. Or possibly ground-attack, especially if cannons were fitted.
I still think the P-59 Airacomet had more potential than its development showed. Its biggest flaw was oversized wings. With wings scaled down to ~84% of the originals, drag would be markedly reduced, and with wing area down to 272 sq ft from 386 sq-ft, wingloading would still be under 47 lb/sq-ft at max load.(12,700 lbs) General streamlining of the fusalage and air intakes would help further. Increase internal fuel capacity and change the armament to 5x .50 cal BMG with 250-300 rpg. Redesign canopy to improve visability. Improve control surfaces. (all metal surfaces plus hydrolic boosting) The reduced drag and increased fuel would significantly increase range. With these improvements and 2,000 lbf J31-GE-5 engines it should have performed on par late model Meteor III. (long nacelles) If redesign work had started right after the tests of the XP-59A in late 1942, the new design should have been ready for testing by mid 1943 and in prodyction by the end of the year. Service evaluation could start in early-mid '44 and full service by early '45. This, of course would have required Bell to put more resourses and top priority for this project, and full access for wind-tunnel testing would have been needed. It would still be surpassed by the P-80 once it had reached its full potential.
I still think the P-59 Airacomet had more potential than its development showed. Its biggest flaw was oversized wings. With wings scaled down to ~84% of the originals, drag would be markedly reduced, and with wing area down to 272 sq ft from 386 sq-ft, wingloading would still be under 47 lb/sq-ft at max load.(12,700 lbs) General streamlining of the fusalage and air intakes would help further. Increase internal fuel capacity and change the armament to 5x .50 cal BMG with 250-300 rpg. Redesign canopy to improve visability. Improve control surfaces. (all metal surfaces plus hydrolic boosting) The reduced drag and increased fuel would significantly increase range. With these improvements and 2,000 lbf J31-GE-5 engines it should have performed on par late model Meteor III. (long nacelles) If redesign work had started right after the tests of the XP-59A in late 1942, the new design should have been ready for testing by mid 1943 and in prodyction by the end of the year. Service evaluation could start in early-mid '44 and full service by early '45. This, of course would have required Bell to put more resourses and top priority for this project, and full access for wind-tunnel testing would have been needed. It would still be surpassed by the P-80 once it had reached its full potential.
Why not? Are there any right or wrongs in this thread if it has to do with aircraft that did not see service?
Now I can not remember exactly what I put the XP-83 in my list over 2 years ago but it probably had to do with the fact that it was a jet escort fighter and it would have been neat to see how it would have developed.
kool kitty89
Senior Master Sergeant
Ok, I didn't mean to critisize, I was just curious of your reasoning. I think it would have been good in WWII for the invasion of Japan, but it would be pretty outdated if it saw service in Korea...
Freebird
Master Sergeant
I'll second the choice of the Arrow! Best jet interceptor in the world at the time. Canadian!?! What??
What a bunch of idiots we had in charge at the time to cancel it!For WWII I would have liked to see the Whirlwind mk.II (redesigned with Merlins replacing Peregrines) I think the flight stats would have been something interesting to see, considering the performance of the original.
kool kitty89
Senior Master Sergeant
But the Arrow wasn't anywhere near WWII... On that note though the CF-100 was a nice plane, the Mk 5 could outrun a Sabre, though certainly not outmaneuver it. It was the fastest straight-winged winged fighter (or warplane) ever built. (I think the only straight-winged production a/c able to break Mach 1) It was superior to the F-89 in almost every way. Nice lookin too. Not bad for a plane that was designed breifly after WWII, and Canada's first (and only?) indiginous fighter, and military jet to see service. It was still serving in some roles in the early '80s, similar endurance in time and versitillity as the Meteor. (interesting, as both were their countries' first combat jet designs)
And I've had another look at the XP-83 and it wasn't that much heavier than the F-84 Thunderjet. (which had a thrust/weight of less than .25 in any model when fully loaded, albeit with good aerodynamics, save for the wings) So with some improvements, it could have been a decent fighter. With some 5950 lbf J42 (licenced Nene with W/I) engines it would have dramatically more thrust and at higher fuel effeciency too. With 6x .60 cal guns, it had a nice armament as well But then again, an improved P-59 (same alterations as before) with Derwent V engines would likely be on par with the P-80 and better in some respects, as the Meteor Mk 4 was at its introduction, and again with the F.8 Meteor.
And I've had another look at the XP-83 and it wasn't that much heavier than the F-84 Thunderjet. (which had a thrust/weight of less than .25 in any model when fully loaded, albeit with good aerodynamics, save for the wings) So with some improvements, it could have been a decent fighter. With some 5950 lbf J42 (licenced Nene with W/I) engines it would have dramatically more thrust and at higher fuel effeciency too. With 6x .60 cal guns, it had a nice armament as well But then again, an improved P-59 (same alterations as before) with Derwent V engines would likely be on par with the P-80 and better in some respects, as the Meteor Mk 4 was at its introduction, and again with the F.8 Meteor.
Sgt. Pappy
Airman 1st Class
- 197
- Jun 7, 2006
As i currently live in Canada, I too, believe the Avro Arrow to have been the best, if not, one of the best jet interceptors in the world at its greatest moments in 1958.
For WWII, I'd like to have a lightened F4U (lightened by at least 250 - 350 lbs. so as to lighten but not degrade dive/zoom performance) fitted with wing slats... it'd be perfect... its already efficient slotted flaps and slats and lightened load would make it turn like a Spitfire, while the act of lightening the plane would give it an improved climb, turn rate and acceleration... the only things it ever lacked. Paddle prop blades would be good too.
BUT for something that actually was built, I would have liked to see the Go229 or Do335 enter service.
For WWII, I'd like to have a lightened F4U (lightened by at least 250 - 350 lbs. so as to lighten but not degrade dive/zoom performance) fitted with wing slats... it'd be perfect... its already efficient slotted flaps and slats and lightened load would make it turn like a Spitfire, while the act of lightening the plane would give it an improved climb, turn rate and acceleration... the only things it ever lacked. Paddle prop blades would be good too.
BUT for something that actually was built, I would have liked to see the Go229 or Do335 enter service.
kool kitty89
Senior Master Sergeant
The arrow was a nice plane, too bad politics, and to a lesser extent, lack of viable engines, killed it. The CF-100 was one of the best, if not the best, all-weather interceptors of it's time. Despite the straight wings, the "Canuck" was a transsonic aircraft.
No worries. Sorry if it came across that way. I was down with the flu and therefore irritated by just the smallest things. Sorry about that.
I'll second the choice of the Arrow! Best jet interceptor in the world at the time. Canadian!?! What??
Go read the thread on the Arrow. The Arrow was a "What if"
kool kitty89
Senior Master Sergeant
He should have said "could have been the best"... Though it has gotten a bit off topic as this was supposed to be what WWII aircraft do you wish had seen service, I believe.
Sgt. Pappy
Airman 1st Class
- 197
- Jun 7, 2006
"believe the arrow to have been the best"
besides, I put a list under that considering the a/c i wanted in service.
johnbr
2nd Lieutenant
For me the Plane that should had saw saw service was the Arado 440 very fast and it was said to great to fly and the Heinkel 277 with four bmw 802.
The thread is supposed to be about WW2 aircraft (as others have pointed out)....
Civettone
Tech Sergeant
Do you have a source for that?
I recall that the Ar 440 was better to fly than the troublesome Ar 240s but "great to fly"??
Kris
kool kitty89
Senior Master Sergeant
Actually the later prototypes of the Ar 240 were nice aircraft, it was the V1 that was really terrible. The performance of the V3 and later were excellent. To be honest, I really think it should have seen production, it would have made a good multi-role a/c.(good night-fighter, heavy-fighter and recon. a/c) Certainly better than the competing Me 210.
I've seen this other places but this wikipedia is the easiest to find:
I've seen this other places but this wikipedia is the easiest to find:
ToughOmbre
Senior Master Sergeant
Grumman F7F Tigercat
TO
TO
