Why no Fw 190H but the Ta 152H? (2 Viewers)

[Engineman]

Look at the image I posted in the previous image - the Ta 152H used a NACA 230xx airfoil at the root. The NACA 5-digit airfoils have very little laminar flow.

Hi,

Thanks for that original data page. The Ta 152 H-1 profile seems to indicate both "NACA 230" and Fw in the box, which is different to all the other types shown. Given the very different detail of the 152 H high aspect ratio wing, is it not likely that this shows a root area NACA 230 profile, developing into an unspecified Fw profile in the very different outer sections?

Cheers

Eng

 

[Reluctant Poster]

FWIW, weight of the wing assembly on the Fw 190A8 was 475 kg.

Each or total.

 

[tomo pauk]

Each or total.

Total, per aircraft.

 

[Engineman]

Each or total.

You would think total, guided by the fact that the 190 wings were built as one unit with a carry-through spar without break-points and, 3 men can carry a single Bf 109 G wing, which come as separate L and R wings.

Eng

 

[Reluctant Poster]

From "The Focke Wulf Ta 152" by Hitchcock:
"Steel had long been planned for both the Fw 190 and the Ta 152; specifically for use in the wing spars and skinning despite a 15 to 25 percent weight penalty. "
Since the paragraph it is taken from is a discussion of the wing design I presume it is 15 to 25 percent of the total wing weight, not the entire aircraft.
250 kg would equate to a wing weight of 1000 to 1700 kg. I can't find any info on the wing weights but it doesn't seem reasonable to me.

"Focke Wulf Ta 152" by Dieter Harmann gives a breakdown of weights for the Ta 152 H-0 and H-1.

I was interrupted before I could give the weights . Here they are

I used goggle translate for the English names so please correct as needed.

 

[tomo pauk]

I used goggle translate for the English names so please correct as needed.

'Tragwerke' - 'Lifting device' - wing.
The term 'Triebwerke in der Zelle' - Powerplant parts in the airframe' are the fuel tanks and ancillaries to the fuel system, like pumps, lines, controls, valves etc.
'Triebwerke vor the Brandschott' - 'Powerplant in front of the firewall' includes everything in front of the firewall (but not the guns, for example) - engine, engine bearer, cowling, prop, as well as the cooling system etc. Fw 190s and it's cousins were no jokes in this regard

 

[Aeroweanie]

Hi,

Thanks for that original data page. The Ta 152 H-1 profile seems to indicate both "NACA 230" and Fw in the box, which is different to all the other types shown. Given the very different detail of the 152 H high aspect ratio wing, is it not likely that this shows a root area NACA 230 profile, developing into an unspecified Fw profile in the very different outer sections?

Cheers

Eng

I read the entry in the box as "NACA Fw 230". My interpretation of this is that its saying that the wing airfoils are a Focke Wulf modification of a NACA 230xx airfoil. My guess is that its a modification of the trailing edge, probably by extending the chord, like was done when creating the wing of the A321 from the wing of the A320.

At this point in the war, the Germans were building fighters as fast as possible. To enable this, any changes in design had to be easy to incorporate on the assembly line, involving the maximum reuse of tooling. Changing the whole wing to a different airfoil would require a lot of new tooling. And, I have never seen evidence that Focke Wulf or the AVA developed any laminar flow airfoils during the war. The only German wartime testing of a laminar flow airfoil that I've seen involved the airfoil of the P-51.

 

[Aeroweanie]

I dug through my archives and this is the best I've found so far. Its a Japanese drawing of the Ta 152H wing. I think the source is a Focke Wulf drawing, but I'm still digging to confirm this. It clearly identifies the root to be a NACA 23016, with a leading edge glove forming the strake, and the tip to be a NACA 23010.

 

[Aeroweanie]

This page indicates that the laminar airfoil was proposed for a Jumo 222 powered version of the Ta 152.

"Since retaining the wing of the Ta 152 H would result in an excessively low G limit at the flying weight of the variant Ta 152 with Jumo 222, it's necessary to develop a new wing. For the new wing the latest aerodynamic knowledge will be taken into account by transitioning the airfoil from the original root airfoil, which will be retained near the fuselage, to a laminar airfoil at the landing gear attachment point."