Why was the Barracuda so much slower than the Avenger?

[Admiral Beez]

An even more disappointing Blackburn Firebrand?

Check out the responses to Specification N.8/37, which called for development of a carrier-based single-seat fighter for the Fleet Air Arm, capable of at least 380mph at 15,000ft and armed with 8 Mags.

EDIT: d'oh, beaten to the punch.

IDK. I expect the firms to fail to deliver on the performance specs, especially in the early variants, but I think whatever is chosen would be both interesting and competitive for the MTO and later PTO. Something like a Spitfire with a Mustang's internal fuel, Fulmar's wing fold and robust undercarriage and the Barracuda's excellent landing characteristics (as far as those flaps and wings can work on a fighter without hurting performance) would be a start.

The Barracuda may be ugly, but did you ever see another British-designed monoplane carrier aircraft land with so little drama?


View: https://youtu.be/tnNpUk-6VGo?t=501

 

[Shortround6]

but did you ever see another British-designed monoplane carrier aircraft land with so little drama?

No camera's but the Hurricanes that landed on Board off Norway without arresting hooks?
One Spitfire had problems going to Malta ( Flaps?) and had to return to the carrier, after burning off fuel it landed back aboard, also without arresting hook. Granted it was not a 17kt escort carrier in a flat calm.

 

[EwenS]

No camera's but the Hurricanes that landed on Board off Norway without arresting hooks?
One Spitfire had problems going to Malta ( Flaps?) and had to return to the carrier, after burning off fuel it landed back aboard, also without arresting hook. Granted it was not a 17kt escort carrier in a flat calm.

There were two Spitfire incidents.

1. During Operation Bowery in May 1942, one of the Spitfires launched from USS Wasp, serial BR126, was recovered by the ship after its drop tank refused to draw.

https://www.navsource.org/archives/02/020718b.jpg

2.During Operation Bellows, part of Operation Pedestal in Aug 1942. It took off from Furious and landed on Indomitable, before she was damaged. Contrary to some reports it was returned to Gibraltar It appears in a couple of IWM photos as final aircraft in the range.

OPERATION PEDESTAL, AUGUST 1942

12 August: The bombing of HMS INDOMITABLE: Detailed photograph of the damage to HMS INDOMITABLE's flight deck.

www.iwm.org.uk

 

[Admiral Beez]

No camera's but the Hurricanes that landed on Board off Norway without arresting hooks?
One Spitfire had problems going to Malta ( Flaps?) and had to return to the carrier, after burning off fuel it landed back aboard, also without arresting hook. Granted it was not a 17kt escort carrier in a flat calm.

I would suggest those are examples of dramatic, fingers crossed landings. I was suggesting the opposite.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Possibly obvious, but I find it puzzling that according to Wiki the Barracuda's maximum speed was 38mph slower than the Avenger's despite:I thin

I think the more apt comparison is the speed advantage or lack thereof the Barracuda offered over its predecessors; Swordfish and Albacore.

 

[RCAFson]

I think the more apt comparison is the speed advantage or lack thereof the Barracuda offered over its predecessors; Swordfish and Albacore.

In post #9 I quoted data from the 3 April 1944 strike leaders report:

'Over Norwegian territory,
they flew for 12mins at 165 knots true, then slowly reduced
height while increasing speed to 195 knots true. When no
fighters appeared, Rance ordered the wing into two
columns at 210 knots true to aid flak evasion...'

These speeds are well above the maximum level speed of the Albacore.

 

[Admiral Beez]

These speeds are well above the maximum level speed of the Albacore.

Good info, thanks. Also the Barracuda's speed was competitive with the Nakajima B5N, the primary IJN torpedo bomber. Its successor the B6N did have an advantage.

 

[Reluctant Poster]

I would suggest those are examples of dramatic, fingers crossed landings. I was suggesting the opposite.

Seafury?

 

[Admiral Beez]

Seafury?

IDK, some dodgy traps here.


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6RTCWhZwyN0&pp=ygUaU2UgZnVyeSBsYW5kaW5nIG9uIGNhcnJpd2U%3D

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

IDK, some dodgy traps here.


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6RTCWhZwyN0&pp=ygUaU2UgZnVyeSBsYW5kaW5nIG9uIGNhcnJpd2U%3D

Be fair -- there's a left-turn at Albuquerque awaiting any carrier landing, no matter how docile the airplane might be.

 

[Frog]

Sea Fury + Firefly.

 

[Reluctant Poster]

Be fair -- there's a left-turn at Albuquerque awaiting any carrier landing, no matter how docile the airplane might be.

Deck landing is hazardous to your health

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh1vYh-3VFE
I am amazed at the bravery of the deck crews.

 

[EwenS]

Just like motor racing the crashes are more spectacular and make more exciting viewing than the rest of the time the cars spend on track.

During the Korean War HMS Glory with an airgroup of Sea Furies and Fireflies produced the following deck landing stats.

First tour Apr-Sept 1951 with 9 patrols.
Firefly deck landings 1,053; accidents 6
Sea Fury deck landings 1,818; accidents 3

They succeeded in having a run of 1,115 accident free deck landings.

Second tour no data on accident numbers

Third tour Nov 1952 - May 1953. 11 patrols.
Firefly deck landings 1,869; accidents 4
Sea Fury deck landings 2,871; accidents 11

This time the best accident free run was 888 deck landings.

The film footage is from HMAS Sydney. I doubt her performance off Korea was significantly different.