Yamato Class - Ballistic Tests on the IJN Shinano's Turret Face Armor

Discussion in 'WW2 General' started by Matt308, Feb 24, 2008.

  1. Matt308

    Matt308 Glock Perfection
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2005
    Messages:
    20,140
    Likes Received:
    54
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Occupation:
    Engineer
    Location:
    Washington State
  2. Matt308

    Matt308 Glock Perfection
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2005
    Messages:
    20,140
    Likes Received:
    54
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Occupation:
    Engineer
    Location:
    Washington State
    And here is the pic from one of the tests
     

    Attached Files:

  3. evangilder

    evangilder "Shooter"
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2004
    Messages:
    19,419
    Likes Received:
    137
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Occupation:
    Network Engineer/Photographer
    Location:
    Moorpark, CA
    Home Page:
    Interesting.
     
  4. freebird

    freebird Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    2,658
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    British Columbia
    Interesting info, thanks Matt!
     
  5. wilbur1

    wilbur1 Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2007
    Messages:
    2,206
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Occupation:
    Mechanik
    Location:
    Escondido,Ca
    Very good reading matt so the germans and japanese had better armor than us but they did it with inferior metals, like i tell my customers its hard to beat german engineering8)
     
  6. Matt308

    Matt308 Glock Perfection
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2005
    Messages:
    20,140
    Likes Received:
    54
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Occupation:
    Engineer
    Location:
    Washington State
    Yeah. I look at my garlic press everyday and marvel that so much thought went into it. Magnificent society.
     
  7. ccheese

    ccheese Member In Perpetuity
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    Messages:
    12,669
    Likes Received:
    96
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Occupation:
    R E T I R E D !!
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, Va.
    I have the book, "Shinano"..... interesting reading about how a US Sub
    sank her before she was actually completed. The book is recommended...

    Charles
     
  8. syscom3

    syscom3 Pacific Historian

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2005
    Messages:
    12,631
    Likes Received:
    309
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Orange County, CA
    I cant wait for delycros to offer his comments.
     
  9. Wayne Little

    Wayne Little Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    51,151
    Likes Received:
    846
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Adelaide Sth. Aust.
    Agree!!
     
  10. delcyros

    delcyros Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2005
    Messages:
    2,037
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Berlin (Kreuzberg)
    This article was submitted by Mr. Nathan Okun, one of the most important and certainly the most influencial recent researcher of the gun vs armour discussion. There are a number of points which needs to be specially mentioned:
    (A) The proposed BB SHINANO turret faceplate was not rejected for it´s use (some of other plates found in the dockyard have been turned down but the decision to finish SHINANO as a carrier made the use of the premanufactured faces for her 18.1" turret plates pointless), so we may accept that they do match the quality acceptance limits.
    (B) The gunnery test showed clearly that this plate could be defeated at normal obliquities by US 16"/50 as those installed in USS IOWA.
    (C) Fortunately for the japanese, they have not installed any of these turret faces vertically but they do lean back 45 deg. and thus are the only part of single spaced armour, ever installed on any warship which could not be defeated by any naval gun(!). Her turret faces are virtually immune against IOWA´s projectiles at all distances. When the obliquity is normal (angle of fall = 45 deg. to match the faceplates declination), the resulting striking velocity is not large enough to make it through.
    (D) with regards to short range penetration power, the IOWAS 16"/50 with 2700lbs APC was considered to be equal to the german 15"/52 (BISMARCK) with 1764 lbs projectile. Both and certainly YAMATO´s own guns may hole the plate at point blanc range and fortunate impact angles. With regards to long range penetration power, the US 16"/50 was considered to be superior to the german 15"/52 and equal to the YAMATO´s 18.1"/45, which in turn has superior short range penetration charackteristics than 15"/52 and 16"/50.

    best regards,
     
  11. wilbur1

    wilbur1 Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2007
    Messages:
    2,206
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Occupation:
    Mechanik
    Location:
    Escondido,Ca
    Good info delcyros thanks
     
  12. delcyros

    delcyros Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2005
    Messages:
    2,037
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Berlin (Kreuzberg)
    The quality of armour is different for countries and types of armour. In general there are two major types: A) Homogenious and B) face hardened armour. The former is composed of a homogenious strength material and emphasizes ductility. The latter is made with an additional super hard, cementated facelayer and a different graduation of a transitional strength distribution in relation to thickness. This armour does not flex like homogenious armour and is designed to induce damage to incoming projectiles, as much as to render them ineffective.

    The best face hardened armour is italian Terni cementated face hardened armour. Second best is UK cementated, followed by german and french. The worst seems to be US class A japanese VH:

    Example: ideal cardonald manufactured 15"/42 (values: 1800 lbs weight with 1600 lbs body weight, all nose coverings intact at impact) fired against 12"
    armour at 20 deg. impact obliquity with 1500 fps striking velocity: Remaining velocity according to Nathan Okuns Fh v.5.8:

    italian Terni CA: 478 fps; UK CA: 582 fps; german KCn/A: 633 fps; US class A: 729 fps; japanese VH: 752 fps.

    In comparison UK US homogenious armour seemed to be the best.
     
Loading...

Share This Page