A Critical Analysis of the RAF Air Superiority Campaign in India, Burma and Malaya in 1941-45

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I don't know much about the CBI TO, but as I understand it, hurricanes were not considered or configured as air superiority fighters generally. They were generally used as ground attack a/c, flying low and slow for maximum effect. If that is the case, they will generally be at a disadvantage if caught in that condition by the enemy.
 
The Dutch tested a Hurricane in the East Indies with half the armament and fuel and it was fully capable of dog fighting the Hayabusa.

Could you expand on that, maybe posting the reports on the test and the circumstances? I'd like to know what mark of Hayabusa (and Hurricane), what condition it was in/how it was captured and what was actually tested/compared.
 
I think you'll find the Hurricanes were initially configured as interceptors and for escort.
 
The first Spitfire Vb's that went to Malta carried the 90 gal slipper (ferry) tank, the Spitfire Vc was able to carry the 170 gal (ferry) slipper tank, IIRC the BPF may have used 90 gal slipper tanks initially but switched to the Kittyhawk tanks. A Spitfire/Seafire could retain the 30 gal slipper tank in combat, the 90/170 gal slipper tanks had operating restrictions on them, like only fly straight and level so hardly any good for offensive missions and intended for ferry missions only. The 45 gal tank was okay for defensive patrols but not much else.
 
The Hurricane was effective against the Ki-27 if it employed boom and zoom tactics. Against the Ki-43, it had a hard time. Success depended on having an altitude advantage, the Hurricane was much faster in a dive so it could break off combat. Its tropical filter and heavy armament restricted its climb rate and agility. Both problems were solvable, an Aboukir filter and reducing the armament.
 
I think you need to do a bit more reading.
 
I think you'll find the Hurricanes were initially configured as interceptors and for escort.
who, in what TO were doing well against the Japanese in the early part of 1942?

I managed to get myself embroiled in a discussion about p-39 performance. it was the wrong thread, but we ended talking about P-39 performance over PNG. Two US Fighter Groups managed to shoot down 7 A6Ms over a period of about 3 months......April to end of June. to all causes these groups lost nearly 60 aircraft achieving that result.

Im not convinced the hurricane was that bad really
 
Probably not, but it does mean that how many enemy aircraft were shot down by Hurricanes is unknown; it's also likely to be a much lower number.
5871 claims for the ETO, 128 confirmed kills by the FAA. Then there's the MTO, the Eastern Front and SE Asia. Divide by 2 and add 50%?
 
Or just divide by 3 or 4; who knows?
I think divide by 2 is the norm, but the figures are just for the ETO, so double for all the remaining theatres of ops after dividing by two. Anyway, if you divide the Hurricane victories by two then that make Spitfire victories in the ETO about 1750, so much for our wonder plane.
 
RAF fighter claims and losses seem to be some the hardest to find on the web, so I wouldn't know how the Spitfire compares to the Hurricane in that regard. However, 5871 claims in the ETO seems rather a how number, seeing as the Hurricane peaked in air combat in the BoB.
 
RCAFson
The F4F-4 had 1 card to play against the Zero, dive to above 300 mph, roll to the right and pull out. We all know the Zero's high speed roll problem, the KI43 did not have the high speed roll problem. I think we are lucky they didn't use the KI43 instead of the Zero, I have come to believe it is the better plane.
I agree the Hurricane was better than an F4F-4 in mock dogfights. In real life vs a Zero the F4F-4 had a couple of advantages: radial engine, I think it had more/better armor, it did not have a fuel tank in front of the pilot that when punctured soaked the pilot in fuel and lit him on fire.
You may not think a Ki27 is a threat, but your forgetting just how well they turn, they probably rivaled a Gladiator. Wildcats had trouble dealing with Japanese biplane float planes due to their extreme agility.

Also remember the Australian test between a Spitfire V and a Zero "The Spitfire has no advantages below 20,000 feet". That quote is from the 2 guys that did the tests
 

I read a long interview with Bobby Gibbes in which he explained the issue with HF - he said HF radios had to be constantly tuned in as the plane was flying around. Said they believed pilots died while fiddling with the radio dials trying to tune in their squadron mates who were yelling at them to 'Break!'

He said VF radios (not sure if he meant VHF but he said VF) were more like modern radios where you just hit a button and it switched channels and stayed tuned-in.

He also mentioned that he was really surprised at the lack of radio discipline when he got to the Pacific. He said in North Africa they had to use radio reciever clicks with special code because if they started talking on the Radio the Germans would quickly figure it out and be on their asses. When he got to the Pacific and went on his first raid in the Solomons he was amazed to hear everyone chattering away like they were in a pub.

S
 

In some respects I think you might be right. Maybe a better fighter killer anyway. Against fighters the relatively 'light' armament isn't really as much of a problem but it does make it harder to knock down medium or heavy bombers.


The advantage the F4F had was it could dive away from a Zero or a Ki-27 - the Ki-43 may not have had as much problem with high speed roll / torque issues but it did have a limit on dive speed, much lower than that of the F4F. The Hurricane could probably dive away from a K-27 but not from an A6M or Ki-43 - at least, the dive speed wasn't enough higher, apparently, plus the Hurricane had relatively poor roll rate.

The ability to disengage in some kind of way when the fight wasn't going well I think turned out to be one of the key features for success in WW2 fighters.

S
 

Agree with this but it's worth noting though that the US P-40 units in the CBI, 23rd FG, 51st, 80th etc., all did quite well against Ki-43. The ability to dive away to disengage, and later on to disengage in level flight, combined with good tactics and the fact that so much of the fighting in the CBI was at low or medium altitude, meant that the P-40 pilots in that Theater had a winning formula against the Ki-27, Ki-43, the A6M, and even (also) against several of the later war fighters like the Ki-44 and Ki-61. According to an old thread on here even the Ki-84.

I do think Ki-43 tends to get very underestimated though, it was a lethal plane.

S
 
Hawker Hurricane - Wikipedia
Its in wikipedia, so it must be true.

Thank you for that, it lead me to a reference to Boer 2006 "The loss of Jawa" which I can't consult. However the relevant passage on wiki seem to be: "That same month, 12 Hurricane Mk IIB Trops were supplied to the Dutch forces on Java. With dust filters removed and fuel and ammo load in wings halved, these were able to stay in a turn with the Oscars they fought." True or not, this alone hardly warrants your claim that a so modified hurricane was "fully capable of dog fighting the Hayabusa".
 

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