A new book in my library.
- Thread starter Wayne Little
- Start date
Ad: This forum contains affiliate links to products on Amazon and eBay. More information in Terms and rules
fubar57
General
Some nice looking books
- Thread starter
- #6,904
Good stuff guys, ah, you will get Vol. 2 done before me then Paul. 
Good stuff guys, ah, you will get Vol. 2 done before me then Paul.
Thanks Guys, LOL Wayne, I will be honest. I did start it yesterday. So far just as good of a read as the first one
Last edited:
- Thread starter
- #6,906
Thanks Guys, LOL Wayne, I will be honest. I did start it yesterday. So far just as good of a read as the first one
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Just received this, which I found at a good price.
This book has intrigued me since it was first published in 2011, but at a cover price of £40 (approx $53 US at today's exchange rate), I was reluctant to buy something that I felt somewhat skeptical about.
The reasons for this are shown below, in the author's claims, which totally go against all the evidence I have in another book, which has first-hand accounts from the French Resistance organisers involved in the raid, as well as escapees and other survivors.
However, as I found a brand new, hard-back copy at £12, I decided to grab it, and I'm looking forward to finding what the author has to say.
This book has intrigued me since it was first published in 2011, but at a cover price of £40 (approx $53 US at today's exchange rate), I was reluctant to buy something that I felt somewhat skeptical about.
The reasons for this are shown below, in the author's claims, which totally go against all the evidence I have in another book, which has first-hand accounts from the French Resistance organisers involved in the raid, as well as escapees and other survivors.
However, as I found a brand new, hard-back copy at £12, I decided to grab it, and I'm looking forward to finding what the author has to say.
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
I've more or less finished it already.
Just under half the book consists of Appendix, mainly copies of various documents, and it's a thick, heavy book !
It would seem that the 'witnesses' and Resistance people involved, that I referred to earlier, are more than somewhat unreliable, being part of the 'plot' to justify the raid, and the subsequent deaths of innocent French people, and the author lays out a good case showing that the raid was not requested by the Resistance, and seems to have been organised via the various branches of British Intelligence, in relation to deception for the Invasion less than four months later..
Although there is no definitive proof of this, and some documents from the various archives have been removed and / or destroyed, this is the likely reason for the raid, as put forward by the author, although there is no firm conclusion offered for the events described.
There is a lot of detail information regarding the raid itself, aircraft, flight descriptions and people involved, many good photos, some hitherto unpublished, maps, and detail info about the lost RAF aircraft, including Pickard's, and the circumstances surrounding their loss.
Although I have yet to read in detail the wealth of documents in the various Appendices, so far, although interesting, I've found this book slightly disappointing, given the title and supporting text promoting the book.
Was it worth the £12 ?
Yes.
Would it have been worth spending the full £40 to read it ?
Probably not.
Just under half the book consists of Appendix, mainly copies of various documents, and it's a thick, heavy book !
It would seem that the 'witnesses' and Resistance people involved, that I referred to earlier, are more than somewhat unreliable, being part of the 'plot' to justify the raid, and the subsequent deaths of innocent French people, and the author lays out a good case showing that the raid was not requested by the Resistance, and seems to have been organised via the various branches of British Intelligence, in relation to deception for the Invasion less than four months later..
Although there is no definitive proof of this, and some documents from the various archives have been removed and / or destroyed, this is the likely reason for the raid, as put forward by the author, although there is no firm conclusion offered for the events described.
There is a lot of detail information regarding the raid itself, aircraft, flight descriptions and people involved, many good photos, some hitherto unpublished, maps, and detail info about the lost RAF aircraft, including Pickard's, and the circumstances surrounding their loss.
Although I have yet to read in detail the wealth of documents in the various Appendices, so far, although interesting, I've found this book slightly disappointing, given the title and supporting text promoting the book.
Was it worth the £12 ?
Yes.
Would it have been worth spending the full £40 to read it ?
Probably not.
fubar57
General
Thanks for the review Terry
- Thread starter
- #6,912
Agreed, thanks Terry.
buffnut453
Captain
Thanks for the review, Terry. 'Fraid I don't buy the whole "deception for the invasion" explanation because the whole point of deception is to mislead the enemy into repositioning forces so they can't engage in the actual battle. Four months is a long time and provided plenty of time for the Germans to realign towards Normandy if necessary...and that's assuming the Germans moved ANY forces in response to this raid. A case could be made that it was part of a wider series of actions to show Allied interest in expanding the resistance movement...but the resistance movement was absolutely needed on D-Day and beyond so, again, if the raid's purpose was deception, then it was actually pointing towards the real events rather than distracting from them.
I think a far more plausible explanation is that someone in the various intelligence organizations simply got it wrong. A word was mis-translated or someone allowed perceptions to cloud the reality of what was happening on the ground. It remains an incredibly feat of airmanship and courage by the Mosquito crews, and leadership by Pickard. But let's not forget the courage of the resistance fighters who were holed up in Amiens Gaol in the first place. Their stories ought to be told as well.
I think a far more plausible explanation is that someone in the various intelligence organizations simply got it wrong. A word was mis-translated or someone allowed perceptions to cloud the reality of what was happening on the ground. It remains an incredibly feat of airmanship and courage by the Mosquito crews, and leadership by Pickard. But let's not forget the courage of the resistance fighters who were holed up in Amiens Gaol in the first place. Their stories ought to be told as well.
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Some of the stories of the Resistance prisoners are told, and it is also made clear that there were no executions scheduled, and the Resistance knew nothing of the raid until it took place.
Contrary to the popular 'version', there were no Resistance members, or vehicles, standing by to help get the released prisoners away to safety, this, seemingly, being part of the post-raid 'story', aided by accounts from a particular Resistance organiser, since shown to be very questionable.
The copies of archive documents show that the raid was 'urgent', and these documents include mention, or referral to, organisations such as MI5 and MI6, SOE, LCS etc.
The aircrews were briefed, as we know, that the raid was to release condemned Resistance patriots, and they carried out their mission with great skill and courage, although the 'official' version of Pickard's loss is not wholly accurate, having been 'managed' by Basil Embry, presumably for patriotic and morale reasons.
I tend to agree that mounting the raid as part of 'Fortitude South' could be seen as a somewhat doubtful reason, and the book mentions, almost in passing, that there 'might' have been a British agent incarcerated in the prison, who had knowledge of the invasion plans, or at least the approximate date, and that perhaps releasing (or silencing) this agent could have been the reason for the raid.
Referral is made to the Gestapo opening coffins to check identities of the dead, although again, no firm conclusions are offered.
If this was the case, then it would perhaps be a more logical, if rather extreme, explanation for what was otherwise seen, at the time, and since (particularly in the Amiens region), as an inexplicable attack on a civilian prison, where innocent lives were bound to be at risk.
As I mentioned, the book does not draw any firm conclusions and, with the apparently 'missing' or 'destroyed' documents from the various archive files, the truth may never be known,
The latest issue (issue 2) of the new 'Wingleader Magazine' (Wingleader are the publishers of the book, as well as the excellent Luftwaffe Crash Archive and BoB Combat Archive series etc.) has a feature on the raid, and is, in part, a much condensed summary of the book, and includes some of the maps, photos and diagrams.
It can be found, free to download, on their website, and is worth a look.
Contrary to the popular 'version', there were no Resistance members, or vehicles, standing by to help get the released prisoners away to safety, this, seemingly, being part of the post-raid 'story', aided by accounts from a particular Resistance organiser, since shown to be very questionable.
The copies of archive documents show that the raid was 'urgent', and these documents include mention, or referral to, organisations such as MI5 and MI6, SOE, LCS etc.
The aircrews were briefed, as we know, that the raid was to release condemned Resistance patriots, and they carried out their mission with great skill and courage, although the 'official' version of Pickard's loss is not wholly accurate, having been 'managed' by Basil Embry, presumably for patriotic and morale reasons.
I tend to agree that mounting the raid as part of 'Fortitude South' could be seen as a somewhat doubtful reason, and the book mentions, almost in passing, that there 'might' have been a British agent incarcerated in the prison, who had knowledge of the invasion plans, or at least the approximate date, and that perhaps releasing (or silencing) this agent could have been the reason for the raid.
Referral is made to the Gestapo opening coffins to check identities of the dead, although again, no firm conclusions are offered.
If this was the case, then it would perhaps be a more logical, if rather extreme, explanation for what was otherwise seen, at the time, and since (particularly in the Amiens region), as an inexplicable attack on a civilian prison, where innocent lives were bound to be at risk.
As I mentioned, the book does not draw any firm conclusions and, with the apparently 'missing' or 'destroyed' documents from the various archive files, the truth may never be known,
The latest issue (issue 2) of the new 'Wingleader Magazine' (Wingleader are the publishers of the book, as well as the excellent Luftwaffe Crash Archive and BoB Combat Archive series etc.) has a feature on the raid, and is, in part, a much condensed summary of the book, and includes some of the maps, photos and diagrams.
It can be found, free to download, on their website, and is worth a look.
Nice set there Jetcal
Thank you!
Please note that my library is listed on LibraryThing and available for local DFW members to come and peruse as desired.
fubar57
General
Good looking books. The Whirlwind one looks interesting
