"All of Vlad's forces and all of Vlad's men, are out to put Humpty together again." (2 Viewers)

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Agreed. Anything else is Neville Chamberlainisque…
 
I think so as well. Regardless we are witnessing serious implications to Russian and global history.

If nothing else, Putin has done two things for the world outside Ukraine:

1) given NATO another 4 or 5 decades of life, and

2) put China on notice that its retaking of Taiwan will probably not be in accordance with the schedule they would like to see.
 
Agreed. Anything else is Neville Chamberlainisque…
Indeed - *if* the League of Nations had lived up to their mission and leaned on Hitler when he attempted to annex the Sudentenland (shades of Donbass anyone?), then the dominoes of Czechslovakia, Austria and Poland would not have fallen.

You do not try to give a rabid dog hugs and kisses and hope all is well ever after...
 
Would be interesting to know how they wanna reach russian soil. Shipping to St Petersburg and then all the way down to Ukraine? To Syria then somehow airlift them? They can't get into Black Sea unless they want to drag Turkey into the war on Ukraine's side.
 
As of 28 February, Turkey closed the Bosphorus to all warships except those based in the Black Sea in accordance to the Montreaux Convention.

So not sure what good any of those ships (and cargo) will do, if they can't reach the Black Sea.
 
The options for peace are dependent on what the options are.

Now you may be 100% right. I maybe 100% wrong.

Maybe Putin cannot be trusted but there is now a difference. Putin is in a jam. So it's now no longer his word but his circumstances that are dictating the rules.

He is now in a very weak position so getting a peace treaty is possible. So the West must capitalize on this weak position to get the best deal.

If you get 5 years peace then that is something.

You must remember as long as the war goes on more and more civilians will be killed. Going down in flames should not be on the table. I don't really care if this may be weak sauce.

Hitler wanted to go down in flames and that's what he did. Doenitz, oddly, didn't want to go down with the ship and signed what he could to stop the war.
 

Only Putin getting out on favorable terms only kicks the can down the road. He will learn fron this, correct his problems, and come back again even stronger and more dangerous. That is why appeasement does not work.
 


How many Patriot batteries do we have in Germany? Enough to provide loaners until a more-permanent replacement can be provided? The Greeks and Bulgarians also field the S-300, perhaps they could provide some loaners in addition or instead of the Patriots, which would obviously require American manning?
 
Appeasement almost always embolden, rather than deters, future aggression. If nothing else, the 30s taught us that.

I give them the benefit of the doubt for the 30s. They had just come out of WW1 and hind sight is always 20/20. Today we have no excuse though. We have Chamberlain to thank for teaching us what not to do.
 
I give them the benefit of the doubt for the 30s. They had just come out of WW1 and hind sight is always 20/20. Today we have no excuse though. We have Chamberlain to thank for teaching us what not to do.

Right, they were feeling their way through those tough times, but the one great thing about hindsight is that it is the basis for learning. Only fools ignore hindsight in more modern times, because history always has something to teach us.

That's why the apparent lack of institutional memory in the Russian army is to me so baffling.
 

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